Hardinge CHNC 1 Lathe

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09 Dec 2009 12:55 - 09 Dec 2009 13:01 #1276 by BigJohnT
Well it looks like the Hardinge CHNC 1 Lathe I bought is going to get converted to EMC. Robh has been working with me to try and get the original control to work. It looks like the PLC opto might be blown. Everything else seems to work.



Here is a crummy video of the axes moving about using some switches for enable and direction and my lab power supply to supply a small voltage to the velocity inputs.



Working on a 10hp phase converter for this one. I should start another thread for that project even though it will be mounted in one of the electrical cabinets of the Hardinge.

John
Last edit: 09 Dec 2009 13:01 by BigJohnT.

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09 Dec 2009 17:35 #1277 by Kirk_Wallace
I'm jealous of your spindle. I have a threaded spindle which makes me a little nervous. If you get any information on how to convert a threaded spindle to A2-5 or if you have a lead to a CHNC spindle, please let me know.

I have a rotary phase converter, and have only one machine left that uses it. A VFD is much easier to deal with. A phase converter actually gives you single phase and a funky in between phase (0 , 180, 270 degrees). I suppose it works but it's not ideal. My HNC works well on 240 VAC single phase with a spindle and coolant VFD.

www.wallacecompany.com/cnc_lathe/HNC/00023-1a.jpg
www.wallacecompany.com/cnc_lathe/HNC/

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09 Dec 2009 19:50 #1279 by BigJohnT
Replied by BigJohnT on topic Re:Hardinge CHNC 1 Lathe
I hooked up a 3hp VFD to try and run the electrics but it kept letting the smoke out of some suppressors so I took it off and hooked up a small phase converter for now. Does your VFD give you a sine wave output? jmkasunich told me that most VFD's use a PWM output and not to use that for the controls. My spindle drive is a siemens drive and very touchy about the voltages on all three legs being even. This lathe is 1987 or 88 model with more safety interlocks than you can shake a stick at.

John

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09 Dec 2009 19:52 #1280 by robh
Replied by robh on topic Re:Hardinge CHNC 1 Lathe
Nice to see some pics up here John
this will be one very quick swift retrofit if needed and will be a quick little machine also, ether way on control side.

dont forget the spindle and axes do a 3Phase to DC buss conversion on the voltage, so a phase converter does not limit the machines performance (only in fact you need to supply enough voltage/amps on spindle starts), his spindle looks happy on a laggy 3rd Phase leg (10% error margin you can have on voltage and phase i believe is the max)

once i get the spindle data manual you can get spindle going too

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09 Dec 2009 20:56 #1281 by BigJohnT
Replied by BigJohnT on topic Re:Hardinge CHNC 1 Lathe
Rob,

Glad to see you on here too. I need to figure out how to enable the interface board and or some other way to turn on the cr's so I can release the spindle brake instead of sticking a nail in the solenoid of the valve. :) I figure this would be a good place to cover the EMC integration of the Hardinge.

Thanks
John

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09 Dec 2009 22:32 #1283 by Kirk_Wallace
I had noise suppressors on the spindle motor leads. These smoked the first time I tried to run the motor with the VFD. I removed them, and the motor and VFD work fine. They smoked because the VFD has a PWM output which has a high frequency component, which these suppressors were designed to suppress, and gave there all doing it. I did need to put a noise suppressor on the input to the VFD. From the other posts, it sounds like your setup is different than mine. I have EMC2 give me a spindle speed value, then a DAC voltage to my VFD, then VFD output to the motor, easy peasey. The VFD has a three phase input, but I cheat, and give it single phase. The only other three phase bit is the flood pump motor, which has its own VFD. My original control power supply ran off of two legs of the three phase. It now runs from the two leads from single phase 240 VAC. It sounds like you have some other three phase stuff? If you have control electronics on three phase, my guess is it gets converted to some other voltage before it gets used. You may have input voltage and phase options on the control supply. My guess, as robh indicated, if this three phase input gets converted to DC, the input diodes and capacitors will be stressed more as you get away from true three phase. Some VFD's have over sized input circuits to allow for three or single phase input. This is mostly me thinking out load, so take it with a grain of salt.
--
Kirk Wallace
www.wallacecompany.com/machine_shop/
www.wallacecompany.com/E45/index.html
California, USA

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29 Dec 2009 01:15 #1406 by BigJohnT
Replied by BigJohnT on topic Re:Hardinge CHNC 1 Lathe
Well I started the conversion of the Hardinge to EMC. The first thing I'm doing is building in a phase converter and putting the work light on a circuit that is not dependent on the controller LOL. I have a freebee 10hp motor for the phase converter and I just traded a propane heater for at 15 hp motor so I'll have to see what works out best for me. Some interesting things I found out is the turrent has a "encoder" as called out in the prints, but it is really a bcd board to indicate the position of the the tool turrent. RobH used the weighted_sum to convert the bcd to a number for the ladder logic to control the tool turrent.

More when I get time.

John

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07 Jan 2010 23:33 #1469 by BigJohnT
Replied by BigJohnT on topic Re:Hardinge CHNC 1 Lathe
Well I finally got something done. The 10hp phase converter motor is installed on it's isolation mounts.



The Mesa cards are on the way now.

John

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08 Jan 2010 00:41 #1470 by tenaja
Replied by tenaja on topic Re:Hardinge CHNC 1 Lathe
John, Are the original cards functional? What are you doing with them?

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08 Jan 2010 20:21 #1474 by robh
Replied by robh on topic Re:Hardinge CHNC 1 Lathe
nice one john,
it will soon be zipping along then.

did you get spindle going yet?

rob

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