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New Machine build from spare parts and a weiss wmd16v (optimum bf16)
- ihavenofish
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21 Sep 2023 19:41 #281331
by ihavenofish
New Machine build from spare parts and a weiss wmd16v (optimum bf16) was created by ihavenofish
So, I need to clear some stuff out, and came to the realisation I have almost an entire mini mill in parts. So seems to me I should build it.
Got a basic plan together, working out finer details now.
The machine base and table are from a weiss wmd16v. This is the same as an optimum bf20. Table is 375mm a 120mm for scale reference. I stole one of the aluminium frame beams from my predator router to use as a column as the weiss column did not take kindly to a linear rail mod (too thin a casting). The whole thing will bolt securely to an 18x24 granite surface plate.
I need to machine a new Z saddle, and XY saddle from mic6 plate I have handy, some motor mounts for a set of way overkill sanyo servos (these motors are for a brother tapping centre!). These are newish drives and old ish motors with 2000 line encoders. not quite on part with a new delta b3, but should beat anything for the price --- free.
The xy ball screws are 1510 nsk c5 ground. I only have 2, so the Z needs a different screw. all I have is a 20mm thk ground screw which is waaaay too large. my solution is to stick it on the side of the column. the geometry is such that the asymmetry should cause an issue.
Spindle, we have 2 main options. One is to use the weiss iron head, and stick a new spindle shaft into it of a more useful taper. Then belt drive it from one of my brother/sanyo 720w servos. about 8000rpm we would get, and ample torque. The shaft i am looking at is an ebay HSK C32. It is cheap, but the gripper for it is $400. oof. And then i need bearings, another $100 (cheap ones). Then a belt and pulley set. It is a lot of work. Also the tools for hskc are expensive and rare. I also looked into an R8 shaft to use TTS tooling, but I did not find any plausible candidates.
I did look at stock belt spindles, but they are too large mostly and wind up even more money than a good electrospindle. Sooo...
Second spindle option is an 80mm atc spindle. I have a line on a couple options that are suitable for milling (as opposed to the more common light engraving models). This is relatively expensive, but probably the best choice. Tool holders are cheap and plentiful, and it is of course ATC vs simply quick change.
Got a basic plan together, working out finer details now.
The machine base and table are from a weiss wmd16v. This is the same as an optimum bf20. Table is 375mm a 120mm for scale reference. I stole one of the aluminium frame beams from my predator router to use as a column as the weiss column did not take kindly to a linear rail mod (too thin a casting). The whole thing will bolt securely to an 18x24 granite surface plate.
I need to machine a new Z saddle, and XY saddle from mic6 plate I have handy, some motor mounts for a set of way overkill sanyo servos (these motors are for a brother tapping centre!). These are newish drives and old ish motors with 2000 line encoders. not quite on part with a new delta b3, but should beat anything for the price --- free.
The xy ball screws are 1510 nsk c5 ground. I only have 2, so the Z needs a different screw. all I have is a 20mm thk ground screw which is waaaay too large. my solution is to stick it on the side of the column. the geometry is such that the asymmetry should cause an issue.
Spindle, we have 2 main options. One is to use the weiss iron head, and stick a new spindle shaft into it of a more useful taper. Then belt drive it from one of my brother/sanyo 720w servos. about 8000rpm we would get, and ample torque. The shaft i am looking at is an ebay HSK C32. It is cheap, but the gripper for it is $400. oof. And then i need bearings, another $100 (cheap ones). Then a belt and pulley set. It is a lot of work. Also the tools for hskc are expensive and rare. I also looked into an R8 shaft to use TTS tooling, but I did not find any plausible candidates.
I did look at stock belt spindles, but they are too large mostly and wind up even more money than a good electrospindle. Sooo...
Second spindle option is an 80mm atc spindle. I have a line on a couple options that are suitable for milling (as opposed to the more common light engraving models). This is relatively expensive, but probably the best choice. Tool holders are cheap and plentiful, and it is of course ATC vs simply quick change.
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- ihavenofish
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21 Sep 2023 22:27 #281338
by ihavenofish
Replied by ihavenofish on topic New Machine build from spare parts and a weiss wmd16v (optimum bf16)
I found a better base. Pallet from a Maho MC5HS. 143lbs of ballast, with a top that is dead flat (once i wipe the rust off.) will be much easier too than drilling holes in granite.
Also, top photography tip from mcdonalds. If you put the worlds smallest 5 axis vise on the machine, it looks misleadingly huge.
Also, top photography tip from mcdonalds. If you put the worlds smallest 5 axis vise on the machine, it looks misleadingly huge.
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21 Sep 2023 23:23 #281339
by ihavenofish
Replied by ihavenofish on topic New Machine build from spare parts and a weiss wmd16v (optimum bf16)
So, I think I am going to use the 7i77 for this to read my servo encoders, but I most likely want step and direction control after my last experience. This machine is fundamentally exactly the same as the brother, just 1/10 the weight.
On the other hand, these sanyo drives are new and high performance, so maybe it will behave. Does it serve any purpose to try to test a servo tuning when it is not actually on the machine?
On the other hand, these sanyo drives are new and high performance, so maybe it will behave. Does it serve any purpose to try to test a servo tuning when it is not actually on the machine?
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22 Sep 2023 17:26 #281398
by tommylight
Replied by tommylight on topic New Machine build from spare parts and a weiss wmd16v (optimum bf16)
You can get the tuning to pretty close, then after installing it would probably be just adjusting the lag/overshot a bit.
This depends on the load, usually the high quality drives are "just get it near" and they take care of the rest, in other words, if not overloaded, usually the work OK on the machine after tuning them on air.
If tuning on air, grab the shaft and try to spin it, if you do not hear it squealing as soon as you touch the shaft, they can be tuned better.
This depends on the load, usually the high quality drives are "just get it near" and they take care of the rest, in other words, if not overloaded, usually the work OK on the machine after tuning them on air.
If tuning on air, grab the shaft and try to spin it, if you do not hear it squealing as soon as you touch the shaft, they can be tuned better.
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22 Sep 2023 18:34 #281407
by ihavenofish
Replied by ihavenofish on topic New Machine build from spare parts and a weiss wmd16v (optimum bf16)
Thanks
I need to get a windows pc up with serial, and then I should be able to give one of these a test. 400w one from the Y axis.... cause....
Just about ready to cut the base up. Single op on the mini router. managed to cram adjustable limits in there, 15mm ball screw, 15mm rails. I need to plan the grease hose and limit cable routing.
I need to get a windows pc up with serial, and then I should be able to give one of these a test. 400w one from the Y axis.... cause....
Just about ready to cut the base up. Single op on the mini router. managed to cram adjustable limits in there, 15mm ball screw, 15mm rails. I need to plan the grease hose and limit cable routing.
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23 Sep 2023 03:11 #281424
by ihavenofish
Replied by ihavenofish on topic New Machine build from spare parts and a weiss wmd16v (optimum bf16)
Oh dear. Milling cast iron on a router with a 40000rpm spindle is... actually fine. Go figure I did dress the router table so it is flat at least to the machine movement. It checks out pretty flat over all - but it is still an aluminium router and not scraped it on meticulously aligned to micron level. I expect at least a little monkeying around on the surface plate post machining.
I set the feeds and speeds ultra conservative, so it will take all day in 2 setups to machine. That ok, we don't want to botch it. It is shockingly expensive to by these parts from grizzly post pandemic.
I set the feeds and speeds ultra conservative, so it will take all day in 2 setups to machine. That ok, we don't want to botch it. It is shockingly expensive to by these parts from grizzly post pandemic.
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23 Sep 2023 19:55 #281502
by ihavenofish
Replied by ihavenofish on topic New Machine build from spare parts and a weiss wmd16v (optimum bf16)
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30 Sep 2023 07:11 #281909
by ihavenofish
Replied by ihavenofish on topic New Machine build from spare parts and a weiss wmd16v (optimum bf16)
Well, I got my sanyo servo running. in their software it has a fair bit of following lag, So I need to learn how to you tune them. The manual is not particularly instructive. "turn on auto tuning" is about the depth of it.
Anyone ever use a sanyo R series drive and servo?
Anyone ever use a sanyo R series drive and servo?
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