LUT5
11 Dec 2012 20:53 - 11 Dec 2012 20:59 #27578
by BigJohnT
I'm still trying to get a grip on the lut5 component so I can improve the manual.
The truth table seems to only show the "and" part
I tried making sense of the hex to binary conversion but that doesn't make sense either.
So then I went to look at the code in the comp and that didn't make much sense either.
The man page hints that the lut5 component is magical and has three types of functions 'and', 'or', and 'xor' but the truth table only shows the 'and' I think as the or function uses 0xfffffffe and that number is not in the truth table. Some experimentation shows that you can combine and and xor in some ways so that is confusing too.
Thanks
John
The truth table seems to only show the "and" part
Bits
4 3 2 1 0 Weight
0 0 0 0 0 0x1
0 0 0 0 1 0x2
0 0 0 1 0 0x4
0 0 0 1 1 0x8
0 0 1 0 0 0x10I tried making sense of the hex to binary conversion but that doesn't make sense either.
binary conversion from hex
0 0 0 0 1 0x1
0 0 0 1 0 0x2
0 0 1 0 0 0x4So then I went to look at the code in the comp and that didn't make much sense either.
FUNCTION(_) {
int shift = 0;
if(in_0) shift += 1;
if(in_1) shift += 2;
if(in_2) shift += 4;
if(in_3) shift += 8;
if(in_4) shift += 16;
out = (function & (1<<shift)) != 0;
}The man page hints that the lut5 component is magical and has three types of functions 'and', 'or', and 'xor' but the truth table only shows the 'and' I think as the or function uses 0xfffffffe and that number is not in the truth table. Some experimentation shows that you can combine and and xor in some ways so that is confusing too.
I know Peter has been trying to explain this to me in another thread but I didn't want to hijack that thread any more. I suspect that bit shifting plays a part in this with the pattern between the truth table and a straight binary conversion of the hex number.A 5-input and function is TRUE only when all the inputs are true, so the correct value for function is 0x80000000.
A 5-input or function is TRUE whenever any of the inputs are true, so the correct value for function is 0xfffffffe.
A 2-input xor function is TRUE whenever exactly one of the inputs is true, so the correct value for function is 0x6. Only in-0 and in-1 should be connected to signals, because if any other bit is TRUE then the output will be FALSE.
Thanks
John
Last edit: 11 Dec 2012 20:59 by BigJohnT.
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11 Dec 2012 21:38 #27579
by cncbasher
just to make your brain hurt more John ,
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bitwise_operation
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bitwise_operation
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11 Dec 2012 21:47 - 11 Dec 2012 21:49 #27580
by BigJohnT
I am somewhat familiar with bit masking from PLC programming I've done in the past and I assumed that was how lut5 was working somehow.
What eludes me is how to determine what numbers to use for the xor and or functions as they are not in the truth table.
John
0011 (decimal 3)
AND 0010 (decimal 2)
= 0010 (decimal 2)John
Last edit: 11 Dec 2012 21:49 by BigJohnT.
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11 Dec 2012 23:20 #27584
by PCW
Note that LUT5 will generate any of the 4,294,967,296
logical functions of 5 inputs so AND,OR,NAND,NOR,XOR
and every other combinatorial function is possible.
I think its easier to not look at it as a logical function generator
but rather as a lookup table. When looked at this way it becomes
simple to generate any logical function of 5 inputs.
Heres how:
write all the input states down (32 for all 5 inputs 16 for 4 inputs , 8 for 3 inputs. 4 for 2 inputs ) with the weight and the desired output state:
Inputs Weight Output
0 0 0 0 0 1 0
0 0 0 0 1 2 1
0 0 0 1 0 4 1
0 0 0 1 1 8 0
When done, add the weights of all the rows with a '1' output together and voila you have the function value for your desired logic. (6 in this case or 2 input XOR)
This could be done with a spreadsheet/python widget fairly easily
logical functions of 5 inputs so AND,OR,NAND,NOR,XOR
and every other combinatorial function is possible.
I think its easier to not look at it as a logical function generator
but rather as a lookup table. When looked at this way it becomes
simple to generate any logical function of 5 inputs.
Heres how:
write all the input states down (32 for all 5 inputs 16 for 4 inputs , 8 for 3 inputs. 4 for 2 inputs ) with the weight and the desired output state:
Inputs Weight Output
0 0 0 0 0 1 0
0 0 0 0 1 2 1
0 0 0 1 0 4 1
0 0 0 1 1 8 0
When done, add the weights of all the rows with a '1' output together and voila you have the function value for your desired logic. (6 in this case or 2 input XOR)
This could be done with a spreadsheet/python widget fairly easily
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12 Dec 2012 20:59 #27622
by BigJohnT
The program is flawed, it only seems to work for all 5 inputs. For example if I put :
but the real answer is 0x8.
If I put
which is correct.
Darn it!
John
see here: wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?Lut5
-m
The program is flawed, it only seems to work for all 5 inputs. For example if I put :
./lut5.py 'i0 & i1'
# expression = i0 & i1
...
# setp lut5.N.function 0x88888888but the real answer is 0x8.
If I put
./lut5.py 'i0 & i1 & i2 & i3 & i4'
# expression = i0 & i1 & i2 & i3 & i4
...
# setp lut5.N.function 0x80000000which is correct.
Darn it!
John
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12 Dec 2012 22:11 #27626
by andypugh
-n ?
The program is flawed, it only seems to work for all 5 inputs.
-n ?
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12 Dec 2012 22:34 #27628
by mhaberler
see here: wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?Lut5
-m
The program is flawed, it only seems to work for all 5 inputs. For example if I put :
./lut5.py 'i0 & i1' # expression = i0 & i1 ... # setp lut5.N.function 0x88888888
but the real answer is 0x8.
No it isnt, go try in HAL
your expression implies 'ignore i2,i3,i4' and the right thing happens with 0x88888888 - the output reacts only to i0 and i1
with 0x8000000 all of i0-i4 must be true which is not reflected in your expression
-m
If I put
./lut5.py 'i0 & i1 & i2 & i3 & i4' # expression = i0 & i1 & i2 & i3 & i4 ... # setp lut5.N.function 0x80000000
which is correct.
Darn it!
John
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12 Dec 2012 22:41 - 12 Dec 2012 22:43 #27630
by BigJohnT
Now I finally understand.... for a 5 input or function it is all of them but one! I finally can make this work in my head... now to try and put this in layman's terms for the docs.
Thanks guys for taking the time to beat this in between my ears.
John
Note that LUT5 will generate any of the 4,294,967,296
logical functions of 5 inputs so AND,OR,NAND,NOR,XOR
and every other combinatorial function is possible.
I think its easier to not look at it as a logical function generator
but rather as a lookup table. When looked at this way it becomes
simple to generate any logical function of 5 inputs.
Heres how:
write all the input states down (32 for all 5 inputs 16 for 4 inputs , 8 for 3 inputs. 4 for 2 inputs ) with the weight and the desired output state:
Inputs Weight Output
0 0 0 0 0 1 0
0 0 0 0 1 2 1
0 0 0 1 0 4 1
0 0 0 1 1 8 0
When done, add the weights of all the rows with a '1' output together and voilà you have the function value for your desired logic. (6 in this case or 2 input XOR)
This could be done with a spreadsheet/python widget fairly easily
Now I finally understand.... for a 5 input or function it is all of them but one! I finally can make this work in my head... now to try and put this in layman's terms for the docs.
./lut5.py 'i0 | i1 | i2 | i3 | i4'
# expression = i0 | i1 | i2 | i3 | i4
#in: i4 i3 i2 i1 i0 out weight
# 0: 0 0 0 0 0 0
# 1: 0 0 0 0 1 1 0x2
# 2: 0 0 0 1 0 1 0x4
# 3: 0 0 0 1 1 1 0x8
# 4: 0 0 1 0 0 1 0x10
# 5: 0 0 1 0 1 1 0x20
# 6: 0 0 1 1 0 1 0x40
# 7: 0 0 1 1 1 1 0x80
# 8: 0 1 0 0 0 1 0x100
# 9: 0 1 0 0 1 1 0x200
#10: 0 1 0 1 0 1 0x400
#11: 0 1 0 1 1 1 0x800
#12: 0 1 1 0 0 1 0x1000
#13: 0 1 1 0 1 1 0x2000
#14: 0 1 1 1 0 1 0x4000
#15: 0 1 1 1 1 1 0x8000
#16: 1 0 0 0 0 1 0x10000
#17: 1 0 0 0 1 1 0x20000
#18: 1 0 0 1 0 1 0x40000
#19: 1 0 0 1 1 1 0x80000
#20: 1 0 1 0 0 1 0x100000
#21: 1 0 1 0 1 1 0x200000
#22: 1 0 1 1 0 1 0x400000
#23: 1 0 1 1 1 1 0x800000
#24: 1 1 0 0 0 1 0x1000000
#25: 1 1 0 0 1 1 0x2000000
#26: 1 1 0 1 0 1 0x4000000
#27: 1 1 0 1 1 1 0x8000000
#28: 1 1 1 0 0 1 0x10000000
#29: 1 1 1 0 1 1 0x20000000
#30: 1 1 1 1 0 1 0x40000000
#31: 1 1 1 1 1 1 0x80000000
# setp lut5.N.function 0xfffffffeThanks guys for taking the time to beat this in between my ears.
John
Last edit: 12 Dec 2012 22:43 by BigJohnT.
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