Hardinge HLV motor and speed control question
31 Mar 2020 11:59 #162241
by jools
Replied by jools on topic Hardinge HLV motor and speed control question
Yes there is a low speed and high speed switch on the headstock casing. I think it's 500 and 1500 rpm.
From my investigations and everyones helpful answers I'm narrowing down to two choices.
Swap for 240v three phase with VFD
Swap out for AC servo
As a side question what kind of torque levels do these type/size of lathe need to work properly? From searching it seems that this motor doesn't have much torque at all.
Cheers all
Jools
From my investigations and everyones helpful answers I'm narrowing down to two choices.
Swap for 240v three phase with VFD
Swap out for AC servo
As a side question what kind of torque levels do these type/size of lathe need to work properly? From searching it seems that this motor doesn't have much torque at all.
Cheers all
Jools
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31 Mar 2020 12:50 #162252
by andypugh
Lathe powers have gone up a lot. If you look at machines from the 60s 1 to 1.5 hp was normal.
Modern CNC lathes can have 50 to 100hp spindle motors. Even manual lathes have 3+ hp (quick Google says the current COlchester Master has a 7.5kW spindle motor)
An AC servo would be a lot more effort and expense to drive, and is a more expensive thing.
If you want to control speed with CNC for CSS etc then it might make sense to swap out the current drivetrain for a 3hp motor and VFD.
If you do that I would go for a slower-speed motor and over-drive it for the max spindle speed to get a bit more torque in the typical operation range.
You might want to also consider changing the belt ratios. Do you know what the output speed range of your variable speed unit is?
Replied by andypugh on topic Hardinge HLV motor and speed control question
You could probably set up a 750rpm motor and a VFD so that the same switch runs it at 500 or 1500. (ie under-drive a bit or run at double speed)Yes there is a low speed and high speed switch on the headstock casing. I think it's 500 and 1500 rpm.
As a side question what kind of torque levels do these type/size of lathe need to work properly?
Lathe powers have gone up a lot. If you look at machines from the 60s 1 to 1.5 hp was normal.
Modern CNC lathes can have 50 to 100hp spindle motors. Even manual lathes have 3+ hp (quick Google says the current COlchester Master has a 7.5kW spindle motor)
An AC servo would be a lot more effort and expense to drive, and is a more expensive thing.
If you want to control speed with CNC for CSS etc then it might make sense to swap out the current drivetrain for a 3hp motor and VFD.
If you do that I would go for a slower-speed motor and over-drive it for the max spindle speed to get a bit more torque in the typical operation range.
You might want to also consider changing the belt ratios. Do you know what the output speed range of your variable speed unit is?
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31 Mar 2020 13:36 - 31 Mar 2020 13:46 #162261
by jools
up to 3000 on the high power level and think it's 60 - 250 on lower level.
With the motor's RPM and HP on high range I make it that it has seven -sh NM of torque.
Could I use a Ebay servo which has 4NM at 2500 RPM. If I geared it down 2:1 then that's 8NM @ the spindle at 1250 RPM (unless torque drops off with speed on these servos) (Something that I've been trying to find on google also but come up blanks for a servo speed torque graph).
Main thing I'm turning is Delrin, max diameter 170mm. I'm not too bothered about removal rates being major as this is being used to produce high value low quantity parts.
Cheers
Jools
Edit. Reason looking at servo's is I can find them on Ebay easily. Searching for 3 phase 220v induction motors seems to bring up every type of motor but
Edit 2: Actually I'm being a moron. I have one of those servo's driving my mill's spindle. I should try that and stop wasting your time until that's been tested
Replied by jools on topic Hardinge HLV motor and speed control question
You might want to also consider changing the belt ratios. Do you know what the output speed range of your variable speed unit is?
up to 3000 on the high power level and think it's 60 - 250 on lower level.
With the motor's RPM and HP on high range I make it that it has seven -sh NM of torque.
Could I use a Ebay servo which has 4NM at 2500 RPM. If I geared it down 2:1 then that's 8NM @ the spindle at 1250 RPM (unless torque drops off with speed on these servos) (Something that I've been trying to find on google also but come up blanks for a servo speed torque graph).
Main thing I'm turning is Delrin, max diameter 170mm. I'm not too bothered about removal rates being major as this is being used to produce high value low quantity parts.
Cheers
Jools
Edit. Reason looking at servo's is I can find them on Ebay easily. Searching for 3 phase 220v induction motors seems to bring up every type of motor but
Edit 2: Actually I'm being a moron. I have one of those servo's driving my mill's spindle. I should try that and stop wasting your time until that's been tested
Last edit: 31 Mar 2020 13:46 by jools. Reason: Adding edit
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31 Mar 2020 16:47 - 31 Mar 2020 16:47 #162275
by andypugh
Maybe try (three phase. 3 phase, 3-P): motor 3HP
Though you could just go to a shop:
inverterdrive.com/group/Motors-AC/?filte...ype%7cInverter+Rated
Is where I would go. Which country are you in?
Replied by andypugh on topic Hardinge HLV motor and speed control question
Edit. Reason looking at servo's is I can find them on Ebay easily. Searching for 3 phase 220v induction motors seems to bring up every type of motor but
Maybe try (three phase. 3 phase, 3-P): motor 3HP
Though you could just go to a shop:
inverterdrive.com/group/Motors-AC/?filte...ype%7cInverter+Rated
Is where I would go. Which country are you in?
Last edit: 31 Mar 2020 16:47 by andypugh.
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03 Apr 2020 15:27 #162587
by jools
Replied by jools on topic Hardinge HLV motor and speed control question
I'm uk. Those look good. Can't for the life of me think why google didn't chuck them up in the numerous searches I did.
Thanks for the link.
Thanks for the link.
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03 Apr 2020 17:52 #162599
by andypugh
Replied by andypugh on topic Hardinge HLV motor and speed control question
4-pole versions seem rated at 7+ Nm and intermittent use at 2880 rpm. I think I would go for those rather than the 2P ones.
inverterdrive.com/group/Motors-AC/TECA2-...cy-3HP-4-Pole-Motor/
inverterdrive.com/group/Motors-AC/TECA2-...cy-3HP-4-Pole-Motor/
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