Stepper Recommendations for Prototype Rifling Machine.
17 Dec 2019 20:51 #152814
by Cutter07
Stepper Recommendations for Prototype Rifling Machine. was created by Cutter07
Morning all.
Let me just start by saying I am very new to linux CNC and this strange new world steppers and code.. I am on a steep learning curve and reading as much as I can about cnc and programming can only get me so far. I actually have to start playing with hardware.
So I am after a recommendation for a stepper motor for the prototype machine that can drive at 180 IPM for the X Axis. I am not sure what the torque will be on the motor, but it will be driving (Through a ball screw) a hook cutter that is cutting 0.00015" each cut.
I went out on a whim and purchased some NEMA 34 Steppers, but I am now finding out that they perhaps are not capable of running at 180 IPM? The steppers I purchased;
Manufacturer Part Number: 34HS38-3008S
Motor Type: Bipolar Stepper
Step Angle: 1.8 deg
Holding Torque(Unipolar): 5Nm(708oz.in)
Holding Torque(Bipolar): 7.07Nm(1001oz.in)
Rated Current/phase(Unipolar): 3.0A
Rated Current/phase(Bipolar Serial): 2.12A
Rated Current/phase(Unipolar Parallel): 4.24A
Phase Resistance(Unipolar): 1.6ohms
Phase Resistance(Bipolar Serial): 3.2ohms
Phase Resistance(Bipolar Parallel): 0.8ohms
Inductance(Unipolar): 8.0mH ± 20%(1KHz)
Inductance(Bipolar Serial): 32.0mH ± 20%(1KHz)
Drivers:
DM860T
Output Peak Current: 2.4~7.2A (6.0 RMS)
Input Voltage: +18~80VAC or 36~110VDC
Logic Signal Current: 7~16mA (Typical 10mA)
Pulse Input Frequency: 0~200kHz
Pulse Width: 2.5μS
Isolation Resistance: 100MΩ
Ideally if I could get a NEMA 34 stepper to suit the drivers I have that would be great, but not critical. This is a proof of concept build and ultimately I will be using servo's if the prototype pans out.
Kind Regards
Let me just start by saying I am very new to linux CNC and this strange new world steppers and code.. I am on a steep learning curve and reading as much as I can about cnc and programming can only get me so far. I actually have to start playing with hardware.
So I am after a recommendation for a stepper motor for the prototype machine that can drive at 180 IPM for the X Axis. I am not sure what the torque will be on the motor, but it will be driving (Through a ball screw) a hook cutter that is cutting 0.00015" each cut.
I went out on a whim and purchased some NEMA 34 Steppers, but I am now finding out that they perhaps are not capable of running at 180 IPM? The steppers I purchased;
Manufacturer Part Number: 34HS38-3008S
Motor Type: Bipolar Stepper
Step Angle: 1.8 deg
Holding Torque(Unipolar): 5Nm(708oz.in)
Holding Torque(Bipolar): 7.07Nm(1001oz.in)
Rated Current/phase(Unipolar): 3.0A
Rated Current/phase(Bipolar Serial): 2.12A
Rated Current/phase(Unipolar Parallel): 4.24A
Phase Resistance(Unipolar): 1.6ohms
Phase Resistance(Bipolar Serial): 3.2ohms
Phase Resistance(Bipolar Parallel): 0.8ohms
Inductance(Unipolar): 8.0mH ± 20%(1KHz)
Inductance(Bipolar Serial): 32.0mH ± 20%(1KHz)
Drivers:
DM860T
Output Peak Current: 2.4~7.2A (6.0 RMS)
Input Voltage: +18~80VAC or 36~110VDC
Logic Signal Current: 7~16mA (Typical 10mA)
Pulse Input Frequency: 0~200kHz
Pulse Width: 2.5μS
Isolation Resistance: 100MΩ
Ideally if I could get a NEMA 34 stepper to suit the drivers I have that would be great, but not critical. This is a proof of concept build and ultimately I will be using servo's if the prototype pans out.
Kind Regards
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17 Dec 2019 21:01 - 17 Dec 2019 21:01 #152815
by Leon82
Replied by Leon82 on topic Stepper Recommendations for Prototype Rifling Machine.
A nema is 34 should be able to do 180 inch per minute unless you have an extreme drive reduction.
I believe they will lose some torque at high RPM.
I believe they will lose some torque at high RPM.
Last edit: 17 Dec 2019 21:01 by Leon82.
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17 Dec 2019 21:10 - 17 Dec 2019 21:11 #152816
by PCW
Replied by PCW on topic Stepper Recommendations for Prototype Rifling Machine.
If you look at the motor torque curve, you will get about 200 oz/inch
(1/5 of static holding torque) at 900 RPM and 80 V
(900 RPM = 180 IPM with .2" pitch ball screws)
(1/5 of static holding torque) at 900 RPM and 80 V
(900 RPM = 180 IPM with .2" pitch ball screws)
Last edit: 17 Dec 2019 21:11 by PCW.
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18 Dec 2019 11:30 #152839
by Cutter07
Replied by Cutter07 on topic Stepper Recommendations for Prototype Rifling Machine.
Evening All,
I played around with some settings and managed to get it about 625 RPM which is about 125 IPM, before the stepper would stall out.
Would the way I have the stepper wired (Bipolar Parallel) be an issue? I chose this because I was reading that high inductance can cause stepper motors to stall at high RPM. Also I forgot to mention that I have a 48VDC power supply, but from the torque chart 900 RPM should be achievable.
For this prototype project, 120 IPM should suffice, but I would be nice to get a better understanding on how to make stepper motors work.
Thanks for your time.
I played around with some settings and managed to get it about 625 RPM which is about 125 IPM, before the stepper would stall out.
Would the way I have the stepper wired (Bipolar Parallel) be an issue? I chose this because I was reading that high inductance can cause stepper motors to stall at high RPM. Also I forgot to mention that I have a 48VDC power supply, but from the torque chart 900 RPM should be achievable.
For this prototype project, 120 IPM should suffice, but I would be nice to get a better understanding on how to make stepper motors work.
Thanks for your time.
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18 Dec 2019 12:56 #152840
by Leon82
Replied by Leon82 on topic Stepper Recommendations for Prototype Rifling Machine.
Are you using a parallel port?
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18 Dec 2019 13:04 #152841
by tommylight
Did you test with the load attached ?
How long is the ballscrew ? That is even more limiting for high speed, they do not like that at all and start to whip.
900 RPM from a stepper motor is to much anyway you look at it, as it will have very low torque, but it might just be usable for some applications.
Replied by tommylight on topic Stepper Recommendations for Prototype Rifling Machine.
Bipolar Parallel is the best possible wiring for what you need,.Would the way I have the stepper wired (Bipolar Parallel) be an issue? I chose this because I was reading that high inductance can cause stepper motors to stall at high RPM. Also I forgot to mention that I have a 48VDC power supply, but from the torque chart 900 RPM should be achievable.
Did you test with the load attached ?
How long is the ballscrew ? That is even more limiting for high speed, they do not like that at all and start to whip.
900 RPM from a stepper motor is to much anyway you look at it, as it will have very low torque, but it might just be usable for some applications.
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19 Dec 2019 07:10 #152899
by Cutter07
Replied by Cutter07 on topic Stepper Recommendations for Prototype Rifling Machine.
Yes I am using a parallel port.
As for load in the stepper. Very minimal. Just the ball screw, which is 900mm long SFU1605 Ball Screw.
As for load in the stepper. Very minimal. Just the ball screw, which is 900mm long SFU1605 Ball Screw.
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07 Jan 2020 20:44 #154253
by andypugh
Replied by andypugh on topic Stepper Recommendations for Prototype Rifling Machine.
I think you might do better with a higher voltage.
You might have more luck with the hybrid (closed loop) steppers.
But as you have noted, this is probably a job for a sizeable servo. eBay is full of them.
You might have more luck with the hybrid (closed loop) steppers.
But as you have noted, this is probably a job for a sizeable servo. eBay is full of them.
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13 Feb 2020 05:21 #157264
by Johnsinski
Replied by Johnsinski on topic Stepper Recommendations for Prototype Rifling Machine.
I have the HobbyCNC stuff, Nema 34 I think, 200 in/oz, 40v ish power.
Just playing around under optimal conditions I've gotten over 400 in/min on a 5mm pitch ballscrew. But I don't actually machine anything at over about 90 in/min and don't rapid at more than 120 in/min.
Also I remember that the stepper motors act much different with load and no load. ie, hooked up to the ball screw vs free spinning.
Stepper motors, dramatically lose torque at higher speeds. At slower speeds with the ballscrews I have they make in the neighborhood of 100 lbs of force on the table. Near their top speed limit, you can just press on the table to stall it.
Just playing around under optimal conditions I've gotten over 400 in/min on a 5mm pitch ballscrew. But I don't actually machine anything at over about 90 in/min and don't rapid at more than 120 in/min.
Also I remember that the stepper motors act much different with load and no load. ie, hooked up to the ball screw vs free spinning.
Stepper motors, dramatically lose torque at higher speeds. At slower speeds with the ballscrews I have they make in the neighborhood of 100 lbs of force on the table. Near their top speed limit, you can just press on the table to stall it.
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