Two retrofitted machines ready for doing some work
- tommylight
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16 Oct 2022 14:15 #254224
by tommylight
Replied by tommylight on topic Two retrofitted machines ready for doing some work
All are PC based, albeit much older and weaker PC's on those machines than what we use home.None of the non-PC based controls I've used
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- fsabbatini
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16 Oct 2022 14:30 #254229
by fsabbatini
Replied by fsabbatini on topic Two retrofitted machines ready for doing some work
Mmm not really, they have a pc, that’s for sure but the motion controller runs on a dedicated hardware. For example Siemens 840d has a Celerino 600mhz for hmi purposes only, the rest is run on a fpga (I supposed they have a cpu core there doing the math plus a bunch of other things)
There are also super powerful controllers such the one from ISG (the one built in Twincat) that is 100% softcnc as linuxcnc, mach3 and others but with all the bells and whistles
There are also super powerful controllers such the one from ISG (the one built in Twincat) that is 100% softcnc as linuxcnc, mach3 and others but with all the bells and whistles
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16 Oct 2022 15:44 #254236
by spumco
Replied by spumco on topic Two retrofitted machines ready for doing some work
Tommy,
As I've said, I'm not an expert here, but the controls I've used fall in to a few categories depending on how you define "PC." Phrasing it inelegantly, "PC" to me means a general purpose personal computer that's had CNC software loaded on it.
As I've said, I'm not an expert here, but the controls I've used fall in to a few categories depending on how you define "PC." Phrasing it inelegantly, "PC" to me means a general purpose personal computer that's had CNC software loaded on it.
- Windows (exclusively) software - Mach3 through parallel port
- Windows front end, dedicated hardware for motion of varying levels of complexity
- Mach3 w/smoothstepper
- UCCNC w/CNCDrive motion board
- Centroid (not sure about the M-400 'industrial' versions)
- Siemens/Acramatic 2100
- WinNT general purpose PC (interface) w/custom RT 2nd computer managing motion
- Emco interchangable training controls (Fanuc, Siemens, Fagor, Hidenhain)
- WinXP/7/10 general purpose PC (interface) w/custom Linux-based RT 2nd computer managing motion
- Linux-only, with (or without) other hardware for some functions
- LCNC
- Masso? (some folks have suspicion)
- Non-windows. Dedicated proprietary hardware for everything (I think).
- Fadal 88
- Siemens 808/840 (haven't fiddled with anything newer)
- Fanuc 21 (not the Emco verson)
- Mazak Mazatrol, can't remember how old, but pretty damn old.
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16 Oct 2022 16:21 #254242
by tommylight
Replied by tommylight on topic Two retrofitted machines ready for doing some work
My point was, they all use PC, all of them.
How they use it and what else is used with those PC' to control those machines is a looooooong subject, some add hardware for features that again uses it's own software to work and communicate with the PC, etc etc.
Or more clearly, my point was the computers are not what separates the good and the bad in those controls, it's the software UI and how good or bad the implementation between soft and hard is.
Personally, having dealt with some of those "professional" and "industrial" implementations, it still is miserable on most of them, starting with the use of windows and the base, that should have never ever been an option for anything "professional" or "industrial", but it still is to this day.
When you have some time, see if you can find how many companies have silently switched from windows to Linux, and will avoid giving any answer regarding that when asked publicly! Been over 15 years since i have done all of the above and much, much more regarding anything with "PC" in it, but the Siemens you keep mentioning was windows, was terrible in every possible way, except to people who got used to it.
I do not mind being terrible for use, every person has his or her idea of how something has to function, and even the best possible HMI will require some learning.
But i do absolutely mind those older Siemens and Kuka and DMG locking solid without any reason and having to run for the main switch.
I read somewhere that KRC4 and up use Linux so that is good for Kuka and Siemens as Siemens does software for Kuka, and Mercedes and many other companies, Siemens is so big that Microsoft made a special stripped down version of XP for them .........
It still locked at random.
DMG still proudly mentions it uses windows,...
How they use it and what else is used with those PC' to control those machines is a looooooong subject, some add hardware for features that again uses it's own software to work and communicate with the PC, etc etc.
Or more clearly, my point was the computers are not what separates the good and the bad in those controls, it's the software UI and how good or bad the implementation between soft and hard is.
Personally, having dealt with some of those "professional" and "industrial" implementations, it still is miserable on most of them, starting with the use of windows and the base, that should have never ever been an option for anything "professional" or "industrial", but it still is to this day.
When you have some time, see if you can find how many companies have silently switched from windows to Linux, and will avoid giving any answer regarding that when asked publicly! Been over 15 years since i have done all of the above and much, much more regarding anything with "PC" in it, but the Siemens you keep mentioning was windows, was terrible in every possible way, except to people who got used to it.
I do not mind being terrible for use, every person has his or her idea of how something has to function, and even the best possible HMI will require some learning.
But i do absolutely mind those older Siemens and Kuka and DMG locking solid without any reason and having to run for the main switch.
I read somewhere that KRC4 and up use Linux so that is good for Kuka and Siemens as Siemens does software for Kuka, and Mercedes and many other companies, Siemens is so big that Microsoft made a special stripped down version of XP for them .........
It still locked at random.
DMG still proudly mentions it uses windows,...
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16 Oct 2022 22:39 #254285
by spumco
Replied by spumco on topic Two retrofitted machines ready for doing some work
I take your point, and you've certainly articulated it better than I did.Or more clearly, my point was the computers are not what separates the good and the bad in those controls, it's the software UI and how good or bad the implementation between soft and hard is.
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16 Oct 2022 22:45 #254287
by spumco
That's a rather nice offer! Yes please.
Although I've never used Ethercat equipment and don't have the Beckhoff(?) main ethercat 'thing' or hub or master (or whatever it's called) that's used to bridge between the computer and drives or I/O.
I've been trying to silently follow the Ethercat threads on this forum for a while, but it hasn't really sunk in yet.
Replied by spumco on topic Two retrofitted machines ready for doing some work
I can make a board and send it to you if you like
Cheers,
Franco
That's a rather nice offer! Yes please.
Although I've never used Ethercat equipment and don't have the Beckhoff(?) main ethercat 'thing' or hub or master (or whatever it's called) that's used to bridge between the computer and drives or I/O.
I've been trying to silently follow the Ethercat threads on this forum for a while, but it hasn't really sunk in yet.
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20 Oct 2022 12:11 - 20 Oct 2022 12:13 #254597
by sivaraj
Replied by sivaraj on topic Two retrofitted machines ready for doing some work
Perfect, that’s exactly what my board does. And it is waaaay simpler than using mesa as wiring is just easy enough for everyone to do.
New version support 1 mpg, axis selector up to 5 axis, increment selector x1,x10,x100. 8 24v pnp inputs for user pushbuttons, 8 24vdc outputs for driving leds of those buttons, feedrate override knob up to 21 positions.
I decided to go this way because I don’t use mesa cards, all Ethercat based si you just go with one wire from pc to board and then to drives and finally to io board. Easy, not a wire mess.
Anyway this board can be expanded for as many io needed. I had a model before with 55 physical buttons but nowadays manufacturer are reducing button count just for motion control and specific always used functions like coolant on/off, chip conveyor on off, etc
I can make a board and send it to you if you like
Cheers,
Franco
What Kind of digital IO module used and what brand of servo drives
Last edit: 20 Oct 2022 12:13 by sivaraj.
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12 Nov 2022 11:07 #256499
by Becksvill
Replied by Becksvill on topic Two retrofitted machines ready for doing some work
hey franco
just want to say that your stuff looks great
i am in new zealand and have been using linuxcnc for several years
26 years old now and started around 18
anyway i saw mention that you have intergrated a jerk control maybe
with s curve accelerations
i am really keen to test this out
and just wanted to send a reply here hoping you see it
cheers
Andrew
just want to say that your stuff looks great
i am in new zealand and have been using linuxcnc for several years
26 years old now and started around 18
anyway i saw mention that you have intergrated a jerk control maybe
with s curve accelerations
i am really keen to test this out
and just wanted to send a reply here hoping you see it
cheers
Andrew
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12 Nov 2022 12:44 #256504
by ChapEng
Replied by ChapEng on topic Two retrofitted machines ready for doing some work
Franco, how did you do the ethercat board? Did you make it completely from scratch? I'm running an ethercat setup and am trying to integrate a pokeys57u to get mpg inputs (4 of them, 3 dedicated for xyz and one for overrides).
I can't seem to find something that can do this anywhere without buying heaps of beckhoff stuff.
Ditto for a 0-10v analogue output (or Rs485).
Would you be willing to sell one of the boards you're using now?
Matt
I can't seem to find something that can do this anywhere without buying heaps of beckhoff stuff.
Ditto for a 0-10v analogue output (or Rs485).
Would you be willing to sell one of the boards you're using now?
Matt
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