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  • djdelorie
  • djdelorie
Today 23:31

Would you use a feed rate for rotary axes in mm/min (surface speed)?

Category: General LinuxCNC Questions

These are mathematical heresies

Sure, but as I noted, sometimes I forget to use G93 and happen to include an A move in something innocuous, and it would be nice if the resulting motion was at least within an order of magnitude of correct instead of the default of stupidly slow.
Also, my third option gave the machine the math it needed to calculate the correct speeds.
  • dbtayl
  • dbtayl
Today 23:29
Replied by dbtayl on topic Perpetual License CAM

Perpetual License CAM

Category: Show Your Stuff

So far a mixed bag for me. For context, I normally use FreeCAD's CAM, which is honestly really good most of the time... except for occasionally breaking in seemingly incredibly dumb ways (ie, simple contour operations have gotten broken multiple times). That's been frustrating enough I was willing to try throwing some money at the problem- looking for a stop-gap "works" solution until FreeCAD stabilizes enough to stop driving me up the wall. No matter how good a standalone CAM package gets, not being integrated with your CAD is a hindrance.

Most of the stuff I do is multiple tools, generally "2.5D" (ie, very little surfacing), but operations on multiple sides and undercuts are common. Normally I'll use adaptive to rough the inside and outside- sometimes different areas w/ different stepdowns to optimize MRR- then add some contours/finishing passes to clean up edges/corners. Drill, undercut, chamfer/deburr, then cut off and flip for the other side.

The below is a "review" of version 1.0.7. Full disclosure I've only messed with it for a couple hours, so I may be wrong about some of these things! It's possible I just haven't figured out how to do stuff yet. 

My current take is that it's a nice teaser/tech demo, but doesn't have nearly enough control to make parts in practice. Everything I listed in the "bad" section below is pretty much a breaking issue for me (YMMV!). That said, I really don't want to be too negative here- the core (actual toolpath generation) seems to work really well! It "just"- fully recognizing that may be a huge task- needs maybe 2-3x as many options for controlling the details of those paths to make it actually useful. (again, for me- YMMV)

If it looks like progress is being made a couple weeks from now I'll probably think it's worth gambling the $200 that it'll get usable for me someday, otherwise I'll be considering the 30-day refund policy.

The good:
  • Runs on Linux, perpetual license- want to encourage that!
  • Speed seems good, both in general use and generating toolpaths (though have only tried small models)- again, very nice in a world full of (eg) node.js burn-your-cpu-to-render-1-fps nonsense.
  • Not mysteriously 10 GB for reasons I can't comprehend!
  • Adaptive toolpaths!!!
  • Actually runs offline- Wireshark confirms that (only ran it for a few minutes, so hardly a conclusive test), manual is offline as well
  • Supported 3Dconnexion mouse out of the box

The odd:
  • Defaults: G43 disabled, 3D mouse Z inverted
  • Output includes "2026-09-30T20:03:01-0500 INFO frontend.licensing.gate: [LICENCE] active, licence_id=xxxxxxxx... updates until 2029-09-27", maybe just a placeholder ETA for when this major version will be done
  • Payment tripped fraud alert, made 3-4 authorizations, though only one of them turned into a real charge
  • UI/workflow is definitely different from FreeCAD and Fusion 360. It seems buggy to me (creating/deleting operations, notably), but I'm trying to withhold judgement until I've used it more.

The bad (a lot of these boil down to "not enough control"):
  • Adaptive ONLY appears to machine the inside of your part- if you want to rough the outside, too bad, I guess?
  • Adaptive has no option to force specific depths- it has a stepdown setting, but will always do Z plane detection and cut any depth it finds one. Really breaks the high-DOC-low-WOC idea of adaptive in practice- especially since it cuts top-down, instead of cutting the bulk out from the bottom, then rest-machining the next layer up, and so on.
  • Chamfer operation is real rough. Sometimes it works when you select a top or bottom face (to chamfer all edges of said face), sometimes it doesn't. Manually selecting edges kinda works, but the hit box for edges is tiny, and the closed loop detection seems to only sometimes work. You can't seem to de-select edges by clicking on them in the model, you need to find them in the list. Some edges it seems to entirely refuse to recognize.
  • No option I can find for ramping into pockets- helix or plunge only. Problematic if you have a long, narrow pocket that you want to ease into, but no space for a helix. Literally the only time I accept a plunge entry is drilling.
  • Lead-in/-out options are limited- you can pick a lead-in radius on some operations, but not others, and you can't add a slight overlap between the lead-in and -out points on closed contours
  • Collision detection seems over-sold- eg, the chamfer operation will happily crash into a wall where the edge you're chamfering meets another face.
  • I'm also not seeing a way to control where an operation starts or to add offsets to start/stop points to manually work around that. Looks like it only does collision detection for 3D operations


I haven't tried a lot of stuff (surfacing, tapping, drilling, actually posting g-code, ...). I tried the automatic feature recognition a bit, and it was hit-and-miss. I have not tried the tool library functionality enough to know how good a job it does of remembering speeds/feeds for different materials/operations/etc.

I somehow thought there was a simulator included, but on further inspection it looks like I made that up based on the collision detection feature, so that's on me. Can always use Camotics, but bouncing between 3 programs while making a model is more obnoxious than just 2.
  • PCW
  • PCW's Avatar
Today 21:31 - Today 21:49
Replied by PCW on topic Servo Driver Plasma Retrofit

Servo Driver Plasma Retrofit

Category: Plasmac

This can likely be fixed in a couple of different ways:

1. Adjust the input zero on the analog servo drive till the static following
error is near zero.

2. Set the PID bias pin to a small value (say somewhere between -.020 to +.020),
again, till the static following error is near zero
(#1 or #2 have equivalent effects, minimizing any small offsets)

3. Add some integral (I)  term to the PID loop
This will zero any static error.

Best option is probably to do 1 or 2  first to eliminate any offset errors
then do 3 (you cannot set 1 or 2 unless the I term is 0)
  • spumco
  • spumco
Today 21:30

Would you use a feed rate for rotary axes in mm/min (surface speed)?

Category: General LinuxCNC Questions

"G93 is fine for me" means nothing.

 


"G93 is fine for me" means

Inverse-time feedrate generated by CAM is sufficient for my needs.

The OP indicated a simple response would be sufficient.  I gave one of the requested responses.

If your provocative post was not directed at me, disregard.

And, as usual, thank you grandixximo for all the work on LCNC.
  • tommylight
  • tommylight's Avatar
Today 21:19
Replied by tommylight on topic Servo Driver Plasma Retrofit

Servo Driver Plasma Retrofit

Category: Plasmac

15in/s2 is 380mm/s2, from pictures the gantry seems really heavy, so you might want to tr 10 or eve 7in/s2.
This does not limit the cutting speed, it just limits the speed on corners, so you might have to also adjust the VAD to 80 or 90%, depending on the amount of dross remaining in the corners.
  • tommylight
  • tommylight's Avatar
Today 21:13

New LinuxCNC Multi-Channel System – Looking for Testers & Feedback

Category: Show Your Stuff

Thank you very much, this is a huge addition to the project, but i have to ask, is this going to be open source?
Or maybe i missed it from a quick glance....
  • kn612
  • kn612
Today 20:43
Replied by kn612 on topic Servo Driver Plasma Retrofit

Servo Driver Plasma Retrofit

Category: Plasmac

Hey guys, been cutting for a while. The table does great, however when needing to cut faster on thinner material the gantry shakes a bit while accelerating and it shows up in the cut.  It gets better when I lower the acceleration all the way to 15in/s/s but is still there.

I noticed while at idle the f error for the dual gantry joints are equal but opposite values. Is that normal?


 


The gantry isn't skewed or in a bind.  It is like that even with the motor/gearboxes disengaged from the gear rack.

 

File Attachment:

File Name: HornetPlas...0-01.ini
File Size:4 KB

 

File Attachment:

File Name: HornetPlas...0-01.hal
File Size:11 KB

 
  • retrofitcenter
  • retrofitcenter
Today 20:10

New LinuxCNC Multi-Channel System – Looking for Testers & Feedback

Category: Show Your Stuff

Hi everyone,I’ve been working on a new multi-channel extension for LinuxCNC, mainly targeting complex turning/milling machines such as INDEX, Gildemeister, multi-spindle lathes and other machines with several independent machining units.The goal is to bring LinuxCNC much closer to the functionality normally found on industrial controls such as Siemens SINUMERIK, especially for machines with multiple turrets, spindles and synchronized machining processes.Main featuresMultiple CNC channelsThe system can run multiple independent machining channels simultaneously. The architecture is not limited to just two channels and is designed to support a very large number of channels, depending mainly on the hardware and machine configuration.Each channel can execute its own NC program independently.Example:
Channel 1 → Turret 1 / Main spindle
Channel 2 → Turret 2 / Sub spindle
Channel 3 → Milling unit
Channel 4 → Additional machining unit
...
Dynamic axis assignmentAxes are not permanently tied to one channel.An axis can be transferred from one machining channel to another during operation.For example:
Channel 1:
X1 Z1 C1

Channel 2:
X2 Z2 C2

Transfer C1 →

Channel 2:
X2 Z2 C2 C1
This makes it possible to handle machines where several machining units need temporary access to the same spindle or axis.Channel synchronizationThe system includes synchronization functions similar to those used on industrial multi-channel controls.Channels can wait for each other or synchronize at defined points inside their NC programs.Typical applications are:
  • part transfer between main and sub spindle
  • synchronized machining
  • waiting for another turret
  • synchronized spindle operations
  • coordinated tool changes
  • machining sequences involving several channels
Turning / milling transformationsSupport for combined turning and milling machines is also included.The system supports transformations for:
  • cylindrical surface machining
  • face machining
  • C-axis milling
  • turning/milling combinations
This allows standard Cartesian milling programs to be transformed to the corresponding rotary-axis movements.3D machine simulationThe HMI includes an integrated 3D machine simulation.It shows:
  • complete machine geometry
  • tools
  • workpiece
  • fixtures
  • spindles
  • turrets
  • axis movements
Material removal is simulated directly during machining.This makes it possible to see the actual workpiece state during program execution.Collision detection / Crash GuardCollision detection runs together with the machine simulation.It can detect collisions between:
  • tool and machine
  • tool and chuck
  • tool and fixture
  • turret and spindle
  • machine components
  • workpiece and machine
Importantly, collision monitoring is not limited to automatic mode.The Crash Guard can also remain active during JOG/manual operation, which is especially useful during setup and commissioning.Tool databaseA more industrial-style tool management system has also been implemented.The tool database supports:
  • tool geometry
  • tool offsets
  • sister tools
  • tool life monitoring
  • remaining tool life
  • automatic replacement with sister tools
  • tool status
  • tool usage tracking
The idea is to provide tool management similar to what operators are used to on modern industrial CNC controls.Industrial HMIThe user interface is designed around typical industrial CNC workflows rather than a traditional desktop/Linux application.The goal is to have a control system that can realistically be used on production machines with touchscreens and machine operator panels.The current development is being tested mainly on turning/milling and multi-channel machine configurations.I’m especially interested in feedback from people who have experience with:
  • INDEX machines
  • Gildemeister / DMG machines
  • multi-spindle machines
  • dual-turret lathes
  • main/sub-spindle machines
  • complex LinuxCNC configurations
I’m also looking for a real machine for extended testing of the multi-channel system.It does not matter whether the machine still has the original drives. Existing analog servo drives with encoder feedback can potentially be retained, or the machine can be converted to EtherCAT servo drives.If anyone is interested in testing the system, contributing, or discussing the architecture, I’d be happy to share more details, screenshots and videos.
  • tuxcnc
  • tuxcnc
Today 15:50
Replied by tuxcnc on topic Is there any idiots guide to GUIs?

Is there any idiots guide to GUIs?

Category: General LinuxCNC Questions

Did you try
pipx install bcnc?
That should install it in its own env, and not conflict with qtDragon at all...
 

Works. Thanks.
  • PCW
  • PCW's Avatar
Today 15:22 - Today 16:35
Replied by PCW on topic PID tuning FF2 not working

PID tuning FF2 not working

Category: General LinuxCNC Questions

Delaying FF1 will make the initial error spike worse.

You need to distinguish between 2 types of error spikes:

A: Errors during constant acceleration (that can be reduced with FF2)
These are relatively constant during the entire ramp up/ramp down
parts of a motion profile.

On a velocity mode servo systems these errors are for 2 reasons:

1. Finite servo drive velocity loop gain
2. Time delay between reading position and drives response to command

#1 can  likely just be guessed at, #2 needs setting FF2 to the time (in seconds) between
position read and drive response.

B: Errors just at the beginning and end of motion.

These are due to the step in acceleration (infinite jerk)  at the beginning and end of motion
and are unavoidable with 2nd order trajectory planners. This is because a step in acceleration
requires the force/torque to change instantly and this is not physically possible in servo systems.

The error can be minimized with better drive tuning or lowering the acceleration but the real solution
is to use a higher order trajectory planner. You might want to try LinuxCNC master's relatively  new
jerk limited trajectory planner, it could use more testers...
  • jschulze
  • jschulze
Today 14:30

Would you use a feed rate for rotary axes in mm/min (surface speed)?

Category: General LinuxCNC Questions

G93 works for me, but I just wanted to say a huge thanks for all your work.  I've been trying to keep up with what you're doing with the s curve stuff and the 5 axis tp work.  It's well beyond the level I could contribute anything, but I'm excited to see all the progress.  
  • Plasmanfm
  • Plasmanfm
Today 14:19 - Today 14:27
Replied by Plasmanfm on topic Perpetual License CAM

Perpetual License CAM

Category: Show Your Stuff

Das Handbuch kommt immer noch nicht…
Es kommt aber nur der Fehler :Not running on one of the supported Live systems“
So wie es aus sieht fehlt mir die Datai das appimaged.service in /etc/systemd/user/ 
wie bekomme ich das da rein ? 

king regard
Juergen
  • grandixximo
  • grandixximo's Avatar
Today 14:16
Replied by grandixximo on topic Is there any idiots guide to GUIs?

Is there any idiots guide to GUIs?

Category: General LinuxCNC Questions

Did you try
pipx install bcnc
? That should install it in its own env, and not conflict with qtDragon at all...

By the way, now that we have the issue pin pointed, I was able to find a small improvement on qtvcp side, it can be hardened so that the UI still runs but the camera widget doesn't, since that is all that actually breaks.

#4612

If you'd like to see when it merges...

Also on bCNC side the core problem is an issue opened in 2022
#1761

And I pushed a fix there as well

#1996

If they both land, then the problem will be totally fixed, and you can use pip, but for now pipx will install bCNC in its own env, and you should be able to work.
  • tuxcnc
  • tuxcnc
Today 13:42
Replied by tuxcnc on topic Installing 2.10 master

Installing 2.10 master

Category: Installing LinuxCNC

The matter became clear.
The problem I described was caused by installing the bcnc program.
So you can use LinuxCNC 2.10 with Debian 13.
At least until you install something that breaks Python's dependencies...
  • tuxcnc
  • tuxcnc
Today 13:35

Would you use a feed rate for rotary axes in mm/min (surface speed)?

Category: General LinuxCNC Questions

Having had my machine slow to a crawl because it applied "in/min" to "degrees" (usually by accident, I use G93 most of the time), I would like an option to "do better".  Some ideas:
* Use radians instead of degrees if you have to use them at all, since those are much closer to linear distance.
* Scale by the WCS Z coordinate to figure out "actual" circumference/distance
* Specify the machine location of the rotary in the config, like Y=10 Z=-3 (which implies it points along X) and calculate circumference based on that
* manually specify some scaling factor
 

These are mathematical heresies.
The whole problem is that it is in no way possible to convert an angle into a length.
They are simply concepts from different categories.
However, you can convert an angle into an arc length if you know the radius.
Since the radius is not listed anywhere in the g-code, it would have to be cleverly specified there.
In my opinion, a new G or M code would be best for this for three reasons:
1. As I wrote earlier, everything would be inside one file, which would eliminate the possibility of a nasty mistake.
2. The G or M code could be used many times in one file, because many diameters can be machined in one piece of material.
3. If someone didn't need it, they wouldn't use it and wouldn't have to be surprised that something was done differently than expected.
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