not understanding where to attach physical wires
- johns00056
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14 Mar 2014 08:34 #44791
by johns00056
Replied by johns00056 on topic not understanding where to attach physical wires
encoder www.galco.com/buy/Danaher-Controls/F152048/80910
The motors are Fanuc red cap model alpha 22/2000 A06B-0147 b075/0075
model 20s A06B-0502-B004
One motor says 8 poles on the label, the other does not specify.
I have about a 3 to one timing belt reduction connected to the ball screws, so I don't need maximum performance.
147 volts 15a 20a stall
The motors are Fanuc red cap model alpha 22/2000 A06B-0147 b075/0075
model 20s A06B-0502-B004
One motor says 8 poles on the label, the other does not specify.
I have about a 3 to one timing belt reduction connected to the ball screws, so I don't need maximum performance.
147 volts 15a 20a stall
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14 Mar 2014 18:41 #44806
by andypugh
You could probably have kept the Fanuc encoders and used their commutation signals.
However, the commutation encoder you have has 3 channels of "Hall" style signals. Those need connecting to GPIO and from there to the bldc component, which should be set to "h" mode (initially)
The hall signals are differential so could conveniently be connected to a spare encoder channel, with the number of encoder modules reduced from the maximum number their input pins become available as GPIO, usefully in your case they will be differential inputs.
This won't be ideal in the final application. because you need all the encoder channels. What do you intend to use for your general IO on the machine?
Replied by andypugh on topic not understanding where to attach physical wires
encoder www.galco.com/buy/Danaher-Controls/F152048/80910
The motors are Fanuc red cap model alpha 22/2000 A06B-0147 b075/0075
You could probably have kept the Fanuc encoders and used their commutation signals.
However, the commutation encoder you have has 3 channels of "Hall" style signals. Those need connecting to GPIO and from there to the bldc component, which should be set to "h" mode (initially)
The hall signals are differential so could conveniently be connected to a spare encoder channel, with the number of encoder modules reduced from the maximum number their input pins become available as GPIO, usefully in your case they will be differential inputs.
This won't be ideal in the final application. because you need all the encoder channels. What do you intend to use for your general IO on the machine?
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- johns00056
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14 Mar 2014 21:32 #44809
by johns00056
Replied by johns00056 on topic not understanding where to attach physical wires
I don't know what I am using for general IO. I am not opposed to getting a second 7i85.
I still have the original Fanuc encoders.
Right now, the motor runs fairly well in cfg=q mode. I can stall the motor with my fingers with some difficulty.
In cfg=iq the motor starts turning continuously (with low torque) as soon as the drive is enabled.
How do I tell if the index mark is being seen?
I still have the original Fanuc encoders.
Right now, the motor runs fairly well in cfg=q mode. I can stall the motor with my fingers with some difficulty.
In cfg=iq the motor starts turning continuously (with low torque) as soon as the drive is enabled.
How do I tell if the index mark is being seen?
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15 Mar 2014 02:23 #44816
by PCW
Replied by PCW on topic not understanding where to attach physical wires
Unfortunately7I85 encoder inputs cannot be used to read the Hall signals since they are multiplexed.
There is an upcoming change to the HostMot2 driver that will allow reading the A/B/I pins directly that addresses this issue
but it's not on the driver yet
In some ways things would be a lot easier with the Fanuc encoders (assuming they are serial pulsecoders)
in that they have a absolute commutation track.that avoids having to deal with Hall signals at all
Also this absolute track is already aligned with the motor rotor, the added encoder is probably not aligned
This does involve running LinuxCNC master but that will make 8I20 EEPROM setting easier as well.
I dont think the sample file has the correct setup for QI mode (home with index)
so will probably just spin forever looking for the index
At the minimum, this line would need to be uncommented
#net motor.00.index-enable hm2_[HOSTMOT2](BOARD).0.encoder.00.index-enable => bldc.0.index-enable
(and of course the encoder mount adjusted so that index occurs at rotor angle 0)
There is an upcoming change to the HostMot2 driver that will allow reading the A/B/I pins directly that addresses this issue
but it's not on the driver yet
In some ways things would be a lot easier with the Fanuc encoders (assuming they are serial pulsecoders)
in that they have a absolute commutation track.that avoids having to deal with Hall signals at all
Also this absolute track is already aligned with the motor rotor, the added encoder is probably not aligned
This does involve running LinuxCNC master but that will make 8I20 EEPROM setting easier as well.
I dont think the sample file has the correct setup for QI mode (home with index)
so will probably just spin forever looking for the index
At the minimum, this line would need to be uncommented
#net motor.00.index-enable hm2_[HOSTMOT2](BOARD).0.encoder.00.index-enable => bldc.0.index-enable
(and of course the encoder mount adjusted so that index occurs at rotor angle 0)
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15 Mar 2014 04:17 #44819
by andypugh
However, index homing still has the problem that the motor has to wiggle by up to a full turn before it can drive the axis properly.
Replied by andypugh on topic not understanding where to attach physical wires
In that case the answer is to use one of the smart-serial ports to mount a GPIO board (such as the 7i84) and use that for the machine IO including the commutation signals.Unfortunately7I85 encoder inputs cannot be used to read the Hall signals since they are multiplexed.
There is an upcoming change to the HostMot2 driver that will allow reading the A/B/I pins directly that addresses this issue
but it's not on the driver yet
There is a programmable offset as a parameter to bldc to adjust for unaligned encoders.(and of course the encoder mount adjusted so that index occurs at rotor angle 0)
However, index homing still has the problem that the motor has to wiggle by up to a full turn before it can drive the axis properly.
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15 Mar 2014 04:32 #44820
by andypugh
Replied by andypugh on topic not understanding where to attach physical wires
This post explains how to set up the commutation track.
www.linuxcnc.org/hardy/index.php/english...p-5i257i858i20#41265
It does assume that the encoder is properly aligned to the motor poles. You didn't say if you did that.
www.linuxcnc.org/hardy/index.php/english...p-5i257i858i20#41265
It does assume that the encoder is properly aligned to the motor poles. You didn't say if you did that.
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- johns00056
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15 Mar 2014 05:31 #44821
by johns00056
Replied by johns00056 on topic not understanding where to attach physical wires
Sometimes the motor works fine with plenty of torque. I moved the table, which weighs more than one ton,
a little today at 300 inches per min. (I still only have 50v in the 147v rated motor.) It did OK except for major
following error and bounceback.
Sometimes the motor "can't find itself" and runs with low torque.
Once in a while the motor just runs away, with low torque. I have not figured out a pattern for the behaviour.
PCW- I tried un commenting that line and it did like you said it would- it ran continuously when enabled.
I did not orient the encoder, I will have to look into that.
a little today at 300 inches per min. (I still only have 50v in the 147v rated motor.) It did OK except for major
following error and bounceback.
Sometimes the motor "can't find itself" and runs with low torque.
Once in a while the motor just runs away, with low torque. I have not figured out a pattern for the behaviour.
PCW- I tried un commenting that line and it did like you said it would- it ran continuously when enabled.
I did not orient the encoder, I will have to look into that.
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15 Mar 2014 05:47 #44823
by andypugh
That is fairly typical for "thump" alignment on a motor which is under load.
I strongly recommend switching to a robust commutation method.
Replied by andypugh on topic not understanding where to attach physical wires
Sometimes the motor "can't find itself" and runs with low torque.
That is fairly typical for "thump" alignment on a motor which is under load.
I strongly recommend switching to a robust commutation method.
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15 Mar 2014 05:58 - 15 Mar 2014 05:59 #44824
by PCW
Replied by PCW on topic not understanding where to attach physical wires
Thump alignment can work pretty well but it needs to have enough torque to do the job
The current 8I20 setup is for 7.5A full scale
7.5A * the bldc init value of 0.3 in the hal; file
limits alignment current to only about 2A which
is likely insufficient to guarantee reliable rotor positioning
You could try increasing the init value (all the way up to 1)
but I suspect that you also have a weak power supply so this may not help much
(and in fact may just drop your power supply voltage so low that the 8I20 throws a LV fault)
The current 8I20 setup is for 7.5A full scale
7.5A * the bldc init value of 0.3 in the hal; file
limits alignment current to only about 2A which
is likely insufficient to guarantee reliable rotor positioning
You could try increasing the init value (all the way up to 1)
but I suspect that you also have a weak power supply so this may not help much
(and in fact may just drop your power supply voltage so low that the 8I20 throws a LV fault)
Last edit: 15 Mar 2014 05:59 by PCW. Reason: sp
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- johns00056
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15 Mar 2014 20:22 #44848
by johns00056
Replied by johns00056 on topic not understanding where to attach physical wires
I don't think torque is the problem ,right now.
Even with the belt off it does not work right every time.
Even with the belt off it does not work right every time.
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