Probe Interface Board Design (resistance switching)

More
2 years 9 months ago #291212 by andypugh
Late to the party....

I have a Renshaw MP3 that I bought from eBay a long time ago )because on eBay "Renshaw" probes go for lower prices than "Renishaw"
I once pressed tool release, with it in the spindle, so did get to see inside. At least with the MP3 there is nothing at all unusual in there, just the 6 balls and 3 bars that you would expect. It also had an inductive interface (just a coil that got connected / opened out by the probe contacts) that I never bothered to set up, instead I made a home-made magsafe connector and used it as a simple switch.

I then found half a dozen Zeiss CMM probes in a skip, and used those for a while (the MP3 was way oversized for my mill). These have an alternative to the Renishaw design, using rods rather than balls, of which more later.
These also have a piezo elemement in them, with the contacts being, presumably, a failsafe. I used these for a few years, but not with the piezo part, just as a conventional probe.
Another feature of these is that they have a parallel (and maybe series? I have forgotten) and series resistor, so that the restance changes, rather than going open-circuit. I wired them to a little interface circuit with a comparator on it to convert to digital output for LinuxCNC. I think that the parallel resistor probably prevents arcing, it feels like it should?

But I was intrugued by the design using rods, as it means that aslong as the _axis_ of the drillings is in the right place, the position of the rods is unimportant. And it's easier to solder to a rod too.
To investigate the robustmess of this design to machining inaccuracies, I made one using only a collet block and a drill press. And it worked farily well. If you make and assemble the body first, and add a screw to clamp it solid you can machine and drill the stylus mount hole into the pre-assembled body, and should get decent accuracy regardless of the internal accuracy.
I made two videos about this, one minimal-tools version, and one using all the fancy tools.


The following user(s) said Thank You: JohnnyCNC, fletch

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

More
2 years 9 months ago - 2 years 9 months ago #291213 by fletch
Oh wow, Andy - that is just such a beautifully simple design! Just eight parts (excluding the stylus & wiring).
I feel a 3D printed version is on the cards so I can continue developing the interface board. It will be interesting to see the difference in contact resistance compared to the Renishaw (or even Renshaw) ebay not-so-much-of-a-bargain. For the 3D printed one, I'll be using some chrome plated brass rod I happen to have lying around.

The piezo is curious - I would have expected that to be used  for some kind of resistance measuring?

Thanks for the hints on order of operations (especially the drilling of the stylus hole) - and for the great videos, including the vice tightening! Morale has been duly lifted.

Philip
Last edit: 2 years 9 months ago by fletch. Reason: Dodgy moral(s). E lad.

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

More
2 years 9 months ago - 2 years 9 months ago #291267 by fletch
Today's tech never ceases to amaze me. 24 hours ago development of the board stalled because my probe broke yet now I have a 3D printed one! Shame the chrome rods are not the best conductors but nothing a quick spin on the lathe tomorrow back to the brass won't solve (tungsten rods on order though).

 

Thanks again Andy - I'll be definitely have a go at designing/making a more precise one - I like the idea of being able to repair/replace it when (not if) I crash it.

Edit: Now I've removed the chrome this now shows similar electrical characteristics as the Renishaw TP6.
Last edit: 2 years 9 months ago by fletch. Reason: It works! Yes, you heard it - IT WORKS!
The following user(s) said Thank You: tommylight

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

More
2 years 9 months ago #291289 by cakeslob
the peizo stuff im pretty sure, was the counter measure to the 3 lobe issue. No idea how to make the newer TP20 probes to work with it though.

Try playing with the tension thing, and back it off all the way. when i was playing with mine, i thought the tension rod had something to do with my issue, but it turned out to not work well when just using a volt meter, i needed to use 24v

The tp6 is bigger than the tp2, so it might be easier to disassemble, but for the tp2 it looks like i need to make some custom tools. i couldnt get it apart easy at all, so i stopped trying because i didnt want to break it. 
The following user(s) said Thank You: fletch

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

More
2 years 9 months ago - 2 years 9 months ago #291334 by fletch
Thanks Cake - now I want to know more about how the piezo compensates for the 3 lobes but I suspect I'll be disappointed.

The TP6 looks like the top cap should unscrew from the main body and/but there are three 'pin holes' that could either be for a specialised pin spanner or need punching out before disassembly. I have called Renishaw but while hopeful, I don't expect an answer soon. The tension screw on mine has never worked - fully out it would stop and there was no fully in. The pressure required to move the stylus never changed so I suspect there's a bit on the loose inside which is now stopping the contacts making.

Up until it broke, the contact resistance was a bit variable (probably because of the lack of spring tension) but operated fine at 5v with the 'check if still open loop' able to detect closed at 0.5v. Now I've removed the chrome, my '3D printed special' shows similar characteristics.

Philip
Last edit: 2 years 9 months ago by fletch.

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

More
2 years 9 months ago #291358 by fletch
The Reishaw TP6 probe is fixed! Hopefully. I modelled a couple of 'tools' to use with 5 x  1.5mm drill bits to use as pin spanners and then bravely took it apart.



Apart from an interference fit that caused a fair bit of head scratching, the process went smoothly. Some of the smallest springs I have ever seen but the culprit was the central spring knocked sideways - a complete pig to reassemble (three times) but it is done. Electrical resistance is quite high, so I suspect I'll have to have it apart again to do a proper clean up.

If anyone is interested in seeing the internals of a Renishaw, then I have a couple of photos, otherwise normal service on the interface board will be resumed.

 

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

Moderators: PCW, jmelson
Time to create page: 0.073 seconds
Powered by Kunena Forum