OKK MCH630-II Retrofit - Possible for a newb?
- Utry2win
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13 Jul 2016 10:10 #77377
by Utry2win
OKK MCH630-II Retrofit - Possible for a newb? was created by Utry2win
Ok, first of all, I am completely green. I am not familiar with ladder logic, I have basic understanding of CNC motion controls, and not in any way familiar with Linux. With all that said. I have a OKK Horizontal machining center with some serious control issues. The machine is circa 1992 and I want away from this Mitsubishi control. Ideally I would love to retrofit this machine, and so far, I really like the idea of Linux CNC. Features of the machine I am concerned with working.
- Full 4-axis movement
- IBAG spindle replacement done in 2004
- Automatic Tool Changer (160 tool, fairly complex changer)
- Pallet Changer
- Machine has Encoders on the motors as well as glass scales for feedback
- Renishaw Probe System (if this did not work, it would not at all be a deal breaker)
- I would really like a remote MPG pendant similar to the XHC HB04
Do you think that a complete newb would (in time, say a few months) be able to get a functioning machine? We are not above paying someone to come in and retrofit the machine either, but I have not found anyone in the business of retrofitting with LinuxCNC yet.
- Full 4-axis movement
- IBAG spindle replacement done in 2004
- Automatic Tool Changer (160 tool, fairly complex changer)
- Pallet Changer
- Machine has Encoders on the motors as well as glass scales for feedback
- Renishaw Probe System (if this did not work, it would not at all be a deal breaker)
- I would really like a remote MPG pendant similar to the XHC HB04
Do you think that a complete newb would (in time, say a few months) be able to get a functioning machine? We are not above paying someone to come in and retrofit the machine either, but I have not found anyone in the business of retrofitting with LinuxCNC yet.
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- BigJohnT
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13 Jul 2016 10:36 #77378
by BigJohnT
Replied by BigJohnT on topic OKK MCH630-II Retrofit - Possible for a newb?
We all start as newb's well except for a few lol.
For larger machines the Mesa 50 pin cards make more sense as you can have an enormous amount of options. Start with a 5i24 or 7i80HD then you can add a 7i44 to really expand the I/O. The 7i73 Pendant Card plugs into the 7i44 and a 7i48 Analog servo interface.
Sam retrofitted his Matsuura Mc 500v in this thread and he has an excellent diagram of the cards he used.
I have a tool turret simulator and a classicladder tutorial here
My best advice is to stay focused on the task and do one thing at a time.
What is an IBAG spindle?
JT
For larger machines the Mesa 50 pin cards make more sense as you can have an enormous amount of options. Start with a 5i24 or 7i80HD then you can add a 7i44 to really expand the I/O. The 7i73 Pendant Card plugs into the 7i44 and a 7i48 Analog servo interface.
Sam retrofitted his Matsuura Mc 500v in this thread and he has an excellent diagram of the cards he used.
computer -> Ethernet -> 7i80 -> 7i48
V
V -> 24 port opto22 board
V
V -> 7i44 -> 7i73
V
V -> 7i69 -> 2x 24 port opto22 boardsI have a tool turret simulator and a classicladder tutorial here
My best advice is to stay focused on the task and do one thing at a time.
What is an IBAG spindle?
JT
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- andypugh
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13 Jul 2016 11:06 #77380
by andypugh
Replied by andypugh on topic OKK MCH630-II Retrofit - Possible for a newb?
So. a bit like this?
forum.linuxcnc.org/forum/show-your-stuff...-hal-component#76485
Do you know if the servo drives are analogue-voltage controlled? The only difficulty I can see that there might be is if there is a proprietary serial data interface from the control to the drives.
forum.linuxcnc.org/forum/show-your-stuff...-hal-component#76485
Do you know if the servo drives are analogue-voltage controlled? The only difficulty I can see that there might be is if there is a proprietary serial data interface from the control to the drives.
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- Utry2win
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13 Jul 2016 11:55 #77383
by Utry2win
IBAG is a brandname of a spindle manufacturer. Apparently the last owner of this machine replaced the spindle in 2004. They went to OKK for a replacement, and there was not one available, and OKK was not going to build another one so they went to a third party to provide a replacement spindle. It still uses the Mitsubishi spindle drive, but not a Mitsubishi motor anymore.
Andypugh - I believe the drives are analogue-voltage controlled, but I have attached pictures of the drives for clarity.
Replied by Utry2win on topic OKK MCH630-II Retrofit - Possible for a newb?
What is an IBAG spindle?
IBAG is a brandname of a spindle manufacturer. Apparently the last owner of this machine replaced the spindle in 2004. They went to OKK for a replacement, and there was not one available, and OKK was not going to build another one so they went to a third party to provide a replacement spindle. It still uses the Mitsubishi spindle drive, but not a Mitsubishi motor anymore.
Andypugh - I believe the drives are analogue-voltage controlled, but I have attached pictures of the drives for clarity.
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13 Jul 2016 12:07 #77384
by andypugh
Replied by andypugh on topic OKK MCH630-II Retrofit - Possible for a newb?
From a Google search the RG101 cared fits on a Meldas Drive.
Not found a lot more than that yet, though.
Not found a lot more than that yet, though.
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13 Jul 2016 12:24 #77386
by Utry2win
Your correct that it is a Meldas control, and I would have taken a picture of the control, but it's out of the machine and in Mitsubishi's hands right now, repairing a board they have "repaired" 3 times already. I'll look for my previous pics, I know I have a few as reference pictures for cable placement and such. When we got this machine, it came from a defense contractor. When we purchased the machine, it was functioning and making parts. When we received it, it was toast. Would not fire up at all. Sent the control to Mits and were told 5 boards were bad (as well as the CRT being toast). They repaired/replaced the bad boards, and we replaced the CRT with a LCD and it would fire up the control, but all parameters and ladder was lost. OKK has not been helpful in providing parameter backups, and with everything set to the paper copies we have, it still is not a functioning machine. We have had Mitsubishi techs in here for several weeks, with very, very little results. The best we have come is getting X and Y axis to move, that is it.
Our best guess is the machine was, as the Mits tech described "destructively decommissioned" by the previous owner. Our thoughts are a large electromagnet in the cabinet. He said he has seen the facility we purchased the machine from do this in the past. Beyond the fact the equipment we purchased in a working order was vandalized and destroyed. We have too much invested in this to walk away, and I'm having serious concerns that Mits will ever get this machine working.
Replied by Utry2win on topic OKK MCH630-II Retrofit - Possible for a newb?
From a Google search the RG101 cared fits on a Meldas Drive.
Not found a lot more than that yet, though.
Your correct that it is a Meldas control, and I would have taken a picture of the control, but it's out of the machine and in Mitsubishi's hands right now, repairing a board they have "repaired" 3 times already. I'll look for my previous pics, I know I have a few as reference pictures for cable placement and such. When we got this machine, it came from a defense contractor. When we purchased the machine, it was functioning and making parts. When we received it, it was toast. Would not fire up at all. Sent the control to Mits and were told 5 boards were bad (as well as the CRT being toast). They repaired/replaced the bad boards, and we replaced the CRT with a LCD and it would fire up the control, but all parameters and ladder was lost. OKK has not been helpful in providing parameter backups, and with everything set to the paper copies we have, it still is not a functioning machine. We have had Mitsubishi techs in here for several weeks, with very, very little results. The best we have come is getting X and Y axis to move, that is it.
Our best guess is the machine was, as the Mits tech described "destructively decommissioned" by the previous owner. Our thoughts are a large electromagnet in the cabinet. He said he has seen the facility we purchased the machine from do this in the past. Beyond the fact the equipment we purchased in a working order was vandalized and destroyed. We have too much invested in this to walk away, and I'm having serious concerns that Mits will ever get this machine working.
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13 Jul 2016 12:33 #77388
by andypugh
Replied by andypugh on topic OKK MCH630-II Retrofit - Possible for a newb?
I wonder if they took out the known-good parts and put in their stock of damaged spares before giving it to you?
The Mitsu drives seem to be very expensive. However I don't think that their motors work with other drives.
Do you have part numbers for the motors? Perhaps there is a more affordable and more "open" drive available that can work with the existing motors.
The Mitsu drives seem to be very expensive. However I don't think that their motors work with other drives.
Do you have part numbers for the motors? Perhaps there is a more affordable and more "open" drive available that can work with the existing motors.
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13 Jul 2016 12:58 #77390
by Utry2win
Replied by Utry2win on topic OKK MCH630-II Retrofit - Possible for a newb?
The x axis motor is a HA200C AC Servo Motor. Says MFG DWG. Z653193.
I was under the impression that the Mesa interface boards would be wired to the existing servo amplifiers to control the motors. Would this not be the case?
I was under the impression that the Mesa interface boards would be wired to the existing servo amplifiers to control the motors. Would this not be the case?
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13 Jul 2016 13:28 #77393
by andypugh
Yes, this would be the normal solution. But you seem to be saying that the drives are broken and are with Mitsubishi, and that you are not optimistic that they can be fixed.
Replied by andypugh on topic OKK MCH630-II Retrofit - Possible for a newb?
I was under the impression that the Mesa interface boards would be wired to the existing servo amplifiers to control the motors. Would this not be the case?
Yes, this would be the normal solution. But you seem to be saying that the drives are broken and are with Mitsubishi, and that you are not optimistic that they can be fixed.
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13 Jul 2016 13:36 #77394
by Utry2win
Replied by Utry2win on topic OKK MCH630-II Retrofit - Possible for a newb?
The Meldas control is at Mitsubishi, not the Amp Drives. The Amp drives appear to be functioning properly.
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