question when using chinese servo drives with original motors

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01 Mar 2019 21:37 - 01 Mar 2019 21:46 #127463 by Richard J Kinch

Have you ever tried going straight to the factories to buy your servo drives?



Yes. The technical information benefits you cite are true, but the logistics get worse. Every bit of the logistics is a struggle, identifying, specifying, specifications misunderstood or missing, confirming specifications, ordering, paying, shipping, tracking, delivery, ...

You also have to be circumspect about who you work with. Every seller in Aliexpress or Alibaba says they are the factory, and has the pictures to prove it. In my experience they're all drop-shippers with a smartphone. You're shopping for precious items in the Silk Market, but over the Internet with somebody who'll put it in the mail. There is no sales operation integrated with factory operations in one place. I've personally visited the country twice to try to arrange business, and its a Gordian knot of trouble to just buy anything. When I buy a few via Aliexpress, it is still weeks of trouble, and no success guaranteed, but it eventually works via remote correspondence over the Internet.

The AASD controllers and the 80ST-M02430, 110ST-M06030, etc., AC servo motors are of mysterious manufacture. There's some hints to the source but Web sites and Web searching don't confirm anything. Somebody makes them somewhere, but that's not for you or me to know. The concept of business identity, product specification, and branding are not operative. I suspect these products are an innocent case of "not designed or officially promoted for export", while it isn't forbidden to export them. Hence you can buy them readily from Aliexpress, but you can't connect to the factory because that's not their mode. Something like the respectable Delta brand of AC servos is much more consistent that way, a world-class product with export support, you can talk to factory sales and order large quantities, but then the price is 3X.
Last edit: 01 Mar 2019 21:46 by Richard J Kinch.

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02 Mar 2019 07:24 #127485 by Becksvill
Hey Richard

I actually run a tooling company here in New Zealand and deal with the factories in china all the time. I sell heaps of carbide endmills and inserts and all sorts of stuff. Lots of it is close in quality with sandvic stuff.

I find that after a while you get used to what normally looks like a genuine factory and what is a drop shipper.

I have been dealing with two separate companies for servos.

One of them "CTB" is the largest servo drive manufacturer in china. They make all sort of cool mill turn style direct drive servo motors and drivers and of course they make the cheap type of standard servo drives. I am definitely not a expert with servos so take this with a grain of salt. But I have found the factories are pretty accessible. Just get past aliexpress and go looking on alibaba or go direct to the factories on google.

Anyway just wanted to give you the info if it helps.

Regards

Andrew
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02 Mar 2019 20:12 #127539 by rodw
I have to agree here. Here in Australia and New Zealand our supply chain is much closer to China so its easier to deal there then with other parts of the world. I've had good luck working with Chinese suppliers. Work through Alibaba though and get some trade samples. Or link the manufacturer back to AliExpress. Aside from a few casual purchases, my first foray was driven by the frustration of being unable to guarantee supply of raw material of engineering plastic and the discussion morphed into the manufacturer machining the parts for me. Samples were provided and tested and the transaction was painless with the supplier packaging and labelling to my requirements. But when it weighs a tonne, you need a good shipping agent. Another simple part I got laser cut, machined and powder coated locally arrived last week. The freight is so cheap its ridiculous. USD $65 per cubic metre by sea.

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03 Mar 2019 22:29 #127632 by Becksvill
Just sent you a connection request Rodw

I was I saw your are in OZ or NZ and wondered if you want to compare notes.

regards

Andrew

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03 Mar 2019 23:23 #127637 by andypugh

Just sent you a connection request Rodw


I don't know what connection requests actually do on this forum. (I guess I should, as a moderator :-)
I did try "connecting" to someone once, and as far as I could tell it didn't achieve anything.

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04 Mar 2019 20:44 #127729 by rodw

Just sent you a connection request Rodw

I was I saw your are in OZ or NZ and wondered if you want to compare notes.

regards

Andrew


So now we are officially connected in a do nothing way.

I'm in Oz. The email messaging on this forum never seems to work but you can contact me here www.vehiclemods.net.au/contact-us

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05 Mar 2019 21:10 #127825 by tommylight

The email messaging on this forum never seems to work but you can contact me here www.vehiclemods.net.au/contact-us

It did work nicely, but suddenly it stopped.
As for connections, they do actually do something, they are in a separate page on your home so you can add additional info about the users and have it saved there.
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05 Mar 2019 21:19 - 05 Mar 2019 21:19 #127826 by rodw
Yeh it used to work. Its actually quite tricky to get reliable email delivery from a third party host and it probably needs some SPF records to be set up in linuxcnc.org's DNS records or something like that. Every now and again the internet goalposts change...
Last edit: 05 Mar 2019 21:19 by rodw.

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08 Mar 2019 01:37 #128056 by tommylight
An SMP server is easy to set up and use, a secure SMP server is another thing altogether.
Spammers scan the net all the time to find SMP servers they can use as relays to spread their evil content !
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12 Jun 2019 01:20 #136680 by Becksvill
Hi Guys Again

I haven't had a chance to get much done on the cnc mill up to this point apart from getting the main spindle working with a YASKAWA’s VS−616G5 drive. I can jog it up to speed and then I have gutted the original heidenhain braking resistor which I am using to slow it down. That is all working now.

I was intending on using a 5i25 and 7i76 as the mesa cards. My servo drives are step and direction. And the spindle is a yaskawa vdf.

original system is heidenhain.

Anyway the plan was just to get the cnc moving and cutting parts without a tool changer and then work on the toolchanger later. Also i Might change or add a 7i77 too later on for full closed loop back to the control. The reason I don't want to go the full 7i77 way from day one is that it looks a bit harder and I am not keen to learn to tune PID loops both in the chinese drive and in linuxcnc at the same time. and I just want to get cutting. and also it costs a extra 80usd per drive for the analog card required to use a 7i77. This cost will be the same in 6 months if I just get them shipped later on from china.

So I have some chinese servo drives coming that I was going to set up with step and direction options. Now I have just been reading up and it looks like the 7i76 board does not have +-10 volts on the spindle analog output. Can someone confirm that please? That will make the job much harder. And also any advice people can give me would be appreciated. I don't want to do this the hard way if possible.

Regards

Andrew

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