help makerspace linuxCNC lathe and mini mill, need to evaluate

tommylight wrote:

I did not miss that, i just do not care, it works and i still have it in use on some machines, it just never fails.

until it does and the only person who knows about it is no longer with us and no one else knows what to do. I am trying to assume that responsibility, or at least get goal one complete so others can assume the same responsibility

OS out of date error message comes up when booting machine that cannot be removed right  now, I think it is stupid to ignore a warning that tells you something is wrong

Same for Wheezy, if it works, why change ?

cannot update. when trying to you get 404's

Also no need to change the parallel port, it works!

true until the PC motherboard fails. not planning on changing, just documenting, and that any upgrades will need to deal with it or plan to replace it it with newer standards

In case you go the changing route, there are parallel port addon cards, there are Mesa boards for PCI, PCI-E and ETH, all can do 2 parallel ports, but at much, much higher speeds, and can do other stuff also, like hardware PWM, encoder counting, etc.

there are parallel cards now, but what about in 10 years? even now parallel cards are rising in price as they are joining the ranks of vintage electronics and will soon be NLA

Aciera wrote:

I agree with tommy, why change a running system just because the OS is not up to date? OS updates are important for systems that are connected to networks because of security.

until the support system for that OS changes so much that updates are impossible
debian wheezy that is on the mill is connected to the internet, but the update fails because all the links are 404

An OS used in a stand alone machine controller does not need to be updated since it's job is to run hardware that is usually also not changing. And just because you have an up to date OS doesn't mean that things are less likely to break or that it will be any easier to fix a problem.

it ends up being much harder to fix once you are unable to troubleshoot an issue due to the original installer did not document anything, so you end up having a problem. is it the OS? is it the controller? is it the application software? is it some esoteric driver? hard to eliminate the OS if the OS cannot be updated

If you want to change from say parallel port interfaces to ethernet then the picture changes.

not a plan now, but maybe after we get all the other issues fixed

But, if you still feel that you need to update the OS, I would advice to get new hardware and keep the current setup available until you are sure everything runs as it should.

willing to donate hardware? hard to find a platform that has parallel ports and m.2 drives with out adding extra hardware

IE don't mess with the existing harddrives!

not until we have them backed up of course. then we could switch from spinning rust to SSD to get a 30% performance boost, which would be significant if we don't upgrade the atom processor PC

there is one thing most responders are missing about this topic

these are makerspace machines

which means that we want to be able to use these machines to attract new members

and that is kind of hard to do when there is an error message that you cannot remove from the screen while trying to demonstrate the machine (like on the cnc lathe)

and not having proper process documents means that existing members are not going to use the machines, because they have no other references

and having zero documentations as to what makes up the machine means that more members will not use the machine, because if it breaks, there is no easy way of finding out what to fix

tommylight wrote:

Shooting down every solution we come up with will get you nowhere.

let step back to my original goals

so I have three goals in mind

• identify the CNC interfaces, OS, and other hardware so we can get some documentation
• fix/update the OS'es so the machines can be run(and document)
• develop process documents and a tutorial plan so new members to the makerspace can learn to use the machines, with simple milestones from manual operation to full use of abilities

the only solutions I've seen is to stick my head in the sand and ignore any error message and run the gear as it
this fails first goal, tries to get around the second goal, and does nothing for the third goal

You should consider yourself very lucky that machines use LinuxCNC, otherwise ....

othterwise?
so far all I've seen is cult-like worship in regards to this thread,
and a total ignorance of keeping machines up to date and in working order

for CNC software that is supposedly the best out there but has a forum that doesn't appear to be helpful, or is able to read and comprehend my request

if this software was so great, these machines would not have been sitting idle for the past two year(maybe longer)

And yes, there are new motherboards with M.2 and parallel port, i just got an MSI Tomahawk X470 that has 6 PCI-E, two M.2 NVME, and a parallel port header, all for 130 Euro with some heavy discount, will get the exact model No when i go to the shop.

yes, and you get ones with RS-232 and even RS-434

but all three communication formats are (sadly) dying out

and before we can eve get to this topic(step2 of the goals wanted) we really need to look at step one 

Just in case you did not notice, this is by far the most user friendly forum on the net, and the fastest to reply, with awesome users that are very willing to help.

I did not notice

and if you look at my whole two threads I've posted. I question your claim

which makes me think that I have to start looking for alternative software for this. I wont expect recommendations from here.

1/ "identify the CNC interfaces, OS, and other hardware so we can get some documentation"
I am going to guess that the Sieg is pretty rare, and the Mill looks like a a home made conversion. If you have already googled and found nothing about these machines, we will also not know.  But if you provide photos of what is under their covers someone can probably help.

Since these are CNC machines, and they are running  linux, there is a pretty good chance they are already running linuxCNC, or EMC2 as it was called back then. If they are, upload the HAL and Ini files here so we an look at them.
Also take the covers off the control cabinets and upload photos. You want to know what drives and interface cards are in there, make photos.

Are you familiar with linux? I am not, and it can be a steep learning curve. I would probably have not got either the Maho or the mini lathe running with out the help freely given here.

My Maho is running on an older version of LinuxCNC. It would be a bit of effort to migrate it to 2.8, as the change to joint notation requires a bit of editing. I am in the camp, if it works dont fcuk with it.

While parallel ports have mostly vanished from MoBo's, there are still LPT cards made. Although I would never do another CNC without Mesa hardware. A 7i92 can also simulate a parallel port if that is what the machine is set up to connect to, but have an ethernet interface to the linux PC of your choice.
Mark

 

Thank you for the answers!

yes they are running linuxCNC, I have not gotten more pics but will do so

where does one find the HAL files, are there any other files to grab? making a backup of the whole CNC software, would that just be one root folder or would I also need to find drivers and such in other places(probably a full backup of drive then, yes?)?

my experience with linux has not been user friendly, I do have Pi's that I put linux on, plus a couple netbooks that I tried to see if linux would give a performance boost(it doesn't)

the Sieg is common, and still being sold model KC4S. I cannot get pics of the computer./interface, as the access panel for this is against the wall. will have to move, which means digging out the engine hoist and getting three helpers .

yeah, I am aware of IO card with parallel, I have two, neither one is PCIE so I should recycle them

mesa hardware? from the context that sound like a good upgrade, just for the future proofing and standardization is there a way in software to see if the lathe is a mesa interface?

and before I run to the space and take more pictures, is there any other specific places that I should take pictures? what screenshots would be ideal? the more you tell me to get pictures of, the more answers we can get