New Build - Tree VMC 1000

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14 Aug 2012 01:22 #23143 by JR1050
Replied by JR1050 on topic Re:New Build - Tree VMC 1000
The Dynapath 20 isnt a half bad control,It has a TON of high level conversational Macro's.if it works ,Id run the machine and make parts and money until I had all my Emc things worked out. The drives are analog dc brush motors.

The tool changer is almost identical to my Marsurra's.It has a sensor for tool1 and another to count to tools afterwards.It should be no problem to write a comp for or do in classic ladder,if thats your thing.

The sequence is find tool one,search for programmed tool by moving the tool chain and counting up or down,stop chain,swing arm,unclamp tool,drop arm ,rotate arm ,put tool that was in the spindle back in its pocket,pull arm up,return arm.Matsurra's are hydraulic,I dont know if the tree is.

Tree's were made by ZPS in Chezslovkia and are built like tanks.Zps is still in business and imports the machines directly into the US.I strongly suspect the lower priced Monarch vmc's are ZPS.For what it is worth.....

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14 Aug 2012 17:13 #23177 by andypugh
dangercraft wrote:

So can I assume correctly that a velocity setup is pretty straight forward with linuxcnc? I ask because my experience with motion control in general is with pulse+dir setups.


A "Velocity mode" drive takes a +/-10V signal from LinuxCNC and converts that to motor speed. (using an internal feedback loop between the motor current and the feedback device, either an encoder or a tacho). In practice there will often be a second hardware loop that controls the power-semiconductor PWM duty-cycle based on measured current).

In a "Torque mode" drive the +/-10V directly controls motor current.

I is also possible for the LinuxCNC PWMgen to control the Power-semiconductors directly. The Mesa 7i39 drives work this way.

LinuxCNC can drive any of the above drives. It can also work quite well with step-direction drives running in velocity mode. The key point is that LinuxCNC itself considers the position feedback and commands the drives to minimise the position error

Do you know what command signal the existing drives take?

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14 Aug 2012 17:42 #23185 by dangercraft
I am waiting for the documentation to arrive from FedEx, it should have been delivered last night but now they are saying today. But, from what I have been able to gather just poking around, these are analog drives so I assume they are velocity mode in control and from what JR previously commented the motors may be brushed DC. In any case, once I get the documentation I'll know for sure, but I am very inclined to remove the existing drives and servos and replace them with more powerful and modern AC drives and servos and control them in Velocity mode as you recommended.

Frank

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14 Aug 2012 17:46 #23187 by dangercraft
The spindle motor on this machine is a Yasakawa 20HP 230V Unit with what I assume is a Yasakawa drive. One of the things I was considering was to change out the drive since the drive seems to be 480V while the rest of the machine is 230V. Since I currently don't have a 480V drop in my shop, I was thinking I would just use a 230V VFD to drive the spindle motor and send the encoder feedback back to linuxcnc. After reading this thread I think I may have been wrong (?). The other option may be to find a 20HP 230V (3PH) spindle drive on ebay, but I am unsure if the spindle drive needs to match the motor. I'm just not too crazy about going through the expense of running 480v into the shop for one component of a single machine.

Frank

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14 Aug 2012 19:02 - 14 Aug 2012 19:02 #23204 by BigJohnT
Is there a step up transformer in the machine now for the spindle drive? Or was the incoming power connection 480v and transformed down for the rest of the machine?

John
Last edit: 14 Aug 2012 19:02 by BigJohnT.

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14 Aug 2012 19:28 - 14 Aug 2012 19:28 #23207 by dangercraft
As far as I can tell, the input is set up for 480v and then stepped down for the rest of the machine.

Frank
Last edit: 14 Aug 2012 19:28 by dangercraft.

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14 Aug 2012 20:47 #23210 by andypugh
dangercraft wrote:
[quotethe drive seems to be 480V while the rest of the machine is 230V. Since I currently don't have a 480V drop in my shop, I was thinking I would just use a 230V VFD to drive the spindle motor and send the encoder feedback back to linuxcnc.[/quote]

The first thing I would try would be to see if the existing VFD will play on 230V. You will lose some power, but 20hp is a lot of spindle.

There is a good chance that the spindle motor will run well (if slightly more slowly) on 230V. It might also be possible to re-wire it for 230. (though if it is a 2 speed motor which I vaguely recall, then this may be complicated)

230V in / 480V out VFDs exist, but will be expensive at 20hp.

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14 Aug 2012 23:23 - 14 Aug 2012 23:27 #23214 by dangercraft
Andy,
I just checked and the plate on the motor says max voltage: 200v so I am guessing the input on the spindle drive is 480v and the output is 200v. I take it running a VFD instead of the spindle drive is a no go then huh? :laugh: I'm not sure if its a 2 speed motor, but it does have a 2 speed gearbox (belt drive) on the spindle and the spindle speeds are supposed to be infinitely variable. I'll try and get a picture of the plate on the motor to post up.

Frank
Last edit: 14 Aug 2012 23:27 by dangercraft.

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14 Aug 2012 23:36 #23215 by dangercraft
This is the plate from the spindle motor.
Attachments:

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14 Aug 2012 23:41 #23216 by dangercraft
The plate on the spindle motor has the following information on it:

Type: UAASKA-15CA1S
Phase: 3
Poles: 4
INS: F

KW: 15/11 RPM:1500 RATING: 30 Min. Cont.
KW: 15/11 RPM:6000 RATING: 30 Min. Cont.

AMP: 80/71A (at 15/11 KW)

VOLT: MAX 200V

RULE: JIS C 4004
JP44: JCAOF4S

Brg. No.: 6310M2ZZAC3P60 6210M2ZZAC3P60

SER.: S138421002

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