Hardinge HNC retrofit and where to start

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15 Jul 2012 20:24 #21968 by andypugh
bobinater wrote:

Does any body have an opinion on the centroid retrofit kit for the HNC lathe
it cost around 4K

Where did you get that number?
www.centroidcnc.com/hardinge_chnc.htm
says at least 11k, possibly 17k if you don't re-use your motors.

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15 Jul 2012 22:21 #21972 by JR1050
I have just pretty much finished a EMC retro on an HNC.My set up is as follows.Mesa 5i20 and 7i33,gigabyte motherboard.I replaced the Hiack amps with AMC 25a20's and the resolvers with Acucoder 3000ppr encoders.I ditched the stock vari speed drive and replaced it with a 3hp Marathon motor and Fuji VFD with braking resistors,and a LONG varispeed style belt. In addition,I also replaced every inch of wire in the machine and scrubbed the oil tank,rebuilt the oil pump and replaced all the pnematic hoses.I use opto i/o,its easy....The timing on the pneumatic turret is the biggest Headache.I also suggest you replace the the axis drive belts,they are like 4 bucks a piece.I built my pendent from an old GE1050 box and mounted it to a hinge I snatched fro the original 550 control along with a bunch of the buttons.I have also since ditched the collet open button/close button for a foot switch and Im building a USB connected user pendent with more traditional buttons,knobs and switches.


I dont do ladder,so I wrote all my PLC's in c using comp.My suggestion is to mount and encoder on each screw,wire an amp(with a kill switch inline) and play around with jogging it.Its gonna take some time and its a big learning curve.The folks on this forum are very helpful.Mesa has a resolver board,if you want to keep the resolvers,you could then keep the tachs and Hiack amps,but they are big and take up alot of space...I prefer to do my machine logic in comp rather than in hal.I like my hal file clean.I bought most of my stuff surplus and I think I have about 1500.00 in the retrofit.In the end it also got a paint job and new lexan for the enclosure.It kills me,I paid 200 for the machine and 175 for the stupid plastic!!!!


Below is a link to the machine running parts.Let me know if I can help out . I wouldnt touch that centroid with a 25ft length of paper tape!!!


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15 Jul 2012 22:30 #21975 by BigJohnT
Very nice! I used 5i20 7i33 7i37's on my CHNC. I've not heard anything positive about the Centroid conversion kit, IIRC one chap never could get his to work...

John

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15 Jul 2012 23:05 - 15 Jul 2012 23:17 #21976 by bobinater
Thanks to both of you guys I am just putting it out there to see what my options are

I am not in a big hurry and am not super concerned with cost I know the lathe will pay

for itself in very little time, what does worry me is having to learn the software

language (worrys me alot) I have never really even tried to write computer code.




thanks again John and JR



Bob
Last edit: 15 Jul 2012 23:17 by bobinater.

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15 Jul 2012 23:23 #21977 by andypugh
bobinater wrote:

Thanks to both of you guys I am just putting it out there to see what my options are
I am not in a big hurry and am not super concerned with cost I know the lathe will pay
for itself in very little time, what does worry me is having to learn the software
language (worrys me alot) I have never really even tried to write computer code.


There shouldn't be much, if any, actual computer code to write.
Try booting the LiveCD and running PNCConf and see if that looks like something you are happy managing.
(I am not sure if the current PNCConf understands the 7i49 card though).

Bear in mind that we aren't going anywhere, so there is plenty of help on hand.

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16 Jul 2012 00:02 #21978 by BigJohnT
bobinater wrote:

Thanks to both of you guys I am just putting it out there to see what my options are
I am not in a big hurry and am not super concerned with cost I know the lathe will pay
for itself in very little time, what does worry me is having to learn the software
language (worrys me alot) I have never really even tried to write computer code.

thanks again John and JR

Bob


Like Andy said we are not going anywhere and many before you have converted the HNC to LinuxCNC. The HAL files are basically one line connections kinda like the wiring between the physical world and the control software. And when you have that part sorted out it is done and you don't have to do it again. Other than some minor differences like pin names if your not using the 5i20 7i33 7i37 route you could just start with my CHNC configuration , it's complete and I've been running it for a year and is on my web site. Of course you will have to determine if you want to retain the resolvers and drives or not and how to deal with that. For 95% of the ops on my CHNC I use ngcgui subroutines for things like facing, OD turning, ID boring, drilling, tapping, threading, taper OD, and profiles. Anyone who puts some effort into the problem around here will get tons of quality help.

John

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16 Jul 2012 00:19 - 16 Jul 2012 00:20 #21979 by andypugh
JR1050 wrote:

.I replaced the Hiack amps with AMC 25a20's and the resolvers with Acucoder 3000ppr encodersp


Both Pico and Mesa have solutions that work with Resolvers now. The Pico system converts the resolver positions to quadrature counts, and the Mesa system is an IO board (the 7i49) which plugs into a Mesa PCI card such as a 5i20 or 5i23.

Pico Resolver converter: www.pico-systems.com/resolver.html
Mesa 7i49: www.mesanet.com/aiodaughter.html

The Mesa site is a bit hard to link to to show specific devices. You can find the front page here: www.mesanet.com

I have developed my own resolver convertor using a $25 Arduino, but I don't think that is really a production-viable solution.
Last edit: 16 Jul 2012 00:20 by andypugh.

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16 Jul 2012 17:18 - 16 Jul 2012 17:23 #22015 by bobinater
Hey guys I am having trouble posting the photos that I took this weekend could somebody tell me how to make them smaller

so I can get them posted, I do not have a homepage or I would just put them there


Bob
Last edit: 16 Jul 2012 17:23 by bobinater. Reason: could not post photos

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16 Jul 2012 18:43 #22019 by BigJohnT
Get Gimp. From Ubuntu you can Applications > Ubuntu Software Center and type in gimp.

When you open an image with Gimp just right click on the image and do image > scale then right click and do file > save as... also note that Gimp has a windoze version too.

John

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16 Jul 2012 20:19 #22031 by JR1050
Bob,

Writing G code is EASY,a lathe is even easier,its two axis!!! I am guessing you are a machinist,if not,you will have some basics to overcome.Probably the biggest hurdle to overcome in doing a retrofit is actually learning how a cnc control works and its associated hardware.I choose to program my PLC in C,because I have prior experience with another control that used BASIC for plc.You can use classic ladder ,which is graphical.The other hurdle is The Linux part,get used to the terminal.....

When I first started with EMC,I bought a couple used servo amps and motors off ebay,hooked them up on a bench and played with the control and motors for a week or two.I then rigged an opto board and some switches and led's to try out the I/o part.


Andy was a HUGE help with the Comp part.Id do some bench testing long before Id start tearing the machine apart.If you have 4k to spend on a Centroid,why not just buy a running CHNC with a Fanuc control off ebay??

If you are worried about programming g code,there are several low cost cam systems you can use,Vector come s to mind,I use it for all my simple stuff.Its quick and easy,'course,it dont run in Linux!!! Go for it...

JR

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