Hypersensing questions

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26 Apr 2020 04:52 #165620 by rodw
Replied by rodw on topic Hypersensing questions
Tommy, I might be wrong but I was asked about submerged cutting earlier today. I did not think it would work as I figured it would trigger as the torch hit the water surface. So it will be interesting to see if you can make it work. If anybody can, you will.

I'm not sure about the 5 volt. The isolated power supply I'm using comes in 5,12,15,24 and 48 volt versions so it would be pretty easy to play with it but you'd need to calculate the scaling resistance per the THCAD manual when you change the voltage. I think I have a second 24v one here so was thinking of joining them in series and testing with 48v but heck its working for me..
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26 Apr 2020 07:30 #165629 by Mike_Eitel
Replied by Mike_Eitel on topic Hypersensing questions
Sorry if a not plasma guy asks:
As i understand your ohmic sensing you always fiffle with voltage. But for me the real question of a "touche on metal" is that then i can see a big current.
To have it complicated i would try to give my probe a high (eventually ac) voltage to breaktrough a oxydised surface and than detect a real current. And i would seperate my probing sensorik via real big distance contacting relais, eventually made myself via pneumatic...
m5c
Mike
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26 Apr 2020 08:50 #165633 by tommylight
Replied by tommylight on topic Hypersensing questions

I'm not sure about the 5 volt. The isolated power supply I'm using comes in 5,12,15,24 and 48 volt versions so it would be pretty easy to play with it but you'd need to calculate the scaling resistance per the THCAD manual when you change the voltage. I think I have a second 24v one here so was thinking of joining them in series and testing with 48v but heck its working for me..

As it stands now, for this use case, less voltage = better, and since it will be off during arc strike and cutting, not much interference to worry about.
@Mike,
Most of this isolation for probing is safety, normally the shield never sees the high voltage besides a small induced part that is very easy to deal with, the issue becomes serious if some dust manages to short the shield and the nozzle. Water will be expelled at the start of the cut as all plasma cutters will first turn on air, then strike and arc.

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26 Apr 2020 10:24 #165647 by rodw
Replied by rodw on topic Hypersensing questions

Sorry if a not plasma guy asks:
As i understand your ohmic sensing you always fiffle with voltage. But for me the real question of a "touche on metal" is that then i can see a big current.
To have it complicated i would try to give my probe a high (eventually ac) voltage to breaktrough a oxydised surface and than detect a real current. And i would seperate my probing sensorik via real big distance contacting relais, eventually made myself via pneumatic...
m5c
Mike


Its really only this thread that discusses voltage in relation to probing. Everybody else is using relays. Plasma is a very hostile environment and compounded where there is water splashing around. By using a THCAD to read the voltage with a component that creates the pin used for probe input, we have a lot more control over the probing process to manage that hostile environment. Plus we have a simpler circuit that is much tougher than a couple of relays. But you can blame PCW it was his idea!

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26 Apr 2020 10:25 #165648 by Mike_Eitel
Replied by Mike_Eitel on topic Hypersensing questions
Yes Tommy.
That was clear to me, what i understand is that you need to find the "starting" hight of your peace very precise. And that is where i guess that "high" current is better than any voltage. Should work also under water. From there you start "burning" and use voltage over plasma as regulation input.
But as i said before, i have no glue of plasma, just done lots of other stuff..
Mike
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26 Apr 2020 10:42 #165651 by tommylight
Replied by tommylight on topic Hypersensing questions

That was clear to me, what i understand is that you need to find the "starting" hight of your peace very precise.

That is where i do not agree with the others, the starting height for a pierce can be anything from 0.5 to 4mm, or more, that depends on the torch used, the type of pilot arc, the thickness of material being cut, air humidity, etc etc.
As a general rule, +-1mm is nothing to worry about for piercing, cutting is a different subject altogether, but since cutting is controlled by the THC, that again is not dependant on probe height.
As an example, an old Hypetherm MAX40 can consistently pierce 5mm thick material from 6mm height. At 7mm it fails.
Some info that might be of interest, pilot arc is done with high voltage between the electrode and the nozzle in the torch, while cutting is done between the electrode and the material.

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26 Apr 2020 20:46 #165697 by snowgoer540
Replied by snowgoer540 on topic Hypersensing questions
Ok, I finally have some data.

Probes 1 and 2 were done after i drenched the torch but pulsed the torch to blow the tip out.
Probe 3 was done with water splashed up into the torch, I opted not to clear it, just for "worst case".

My threshold is set to 23.5v and my powersupply is set to 24.5v.

Also, I kind of like the idea of pulsing the torch prior to starting the first probe if ohmic is enabled.

Let me know what you think of the pictures. I fought with halscope until I finally figured out what I was doing....I think. If I messed some data collection up, let me know and I'll grab new screen shots tomorrow.

Off to cook some steak now!
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27 Apr 2020 14:11 #165823 by snowgoer540
Replied by snowgoer540 on topic Hypersensing questions
Also,

A video demonstration of hypersensing:

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27 Apr 2020 14:16 #165825 by tommylight
Replied by tommylight on topic Hypersensing questions
Very nice ! :)
Thank you.

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28 Apr 2020 03:48 #165895 by snowgoer540
Replied by snowgoer540 on topic Hypersensing questions
How did the halscope plots look? Anything useful? Need me to grab something different?

This is how I felt after spending longer than I care to admit figuring out Halscope:

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