Feature Request

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12 Aug 2020 00:10 - 12 Aug 2020 00:11 #177962 by snowgoer540
Replied by snowgoer540 on topic Feature Request

phillc54 wrote: The way it works at the moment is:

there are two mesh mode checkbuttons, Enable and Ignore OK

Enable disables THC and continues a cut if the arc is lost during the cut (plus it switches to CPA mode on connnected HT machines)

Ignore OK allows a cut to begin without receiving an arc ok signal. This checkbtton is only read when mesh mode is enabled.

motion.digital-out-01 behaves the same way as Enable

I think Rod is suggesting that Ignore OK should be able to be used at any time.

I think we are on the same page, that's what I was tracking


I may not want it to change to CPA mode in the middle of a cut if I were ignoring the ARC-OK for other reasons

does Rod's suggestion satisfy this.

I don't think so. I definitely want to be able to control motion.digital-out-01 via G Code. Which it does, via enabling mesh mode, and I think now that I think about it even more, everything that it does currently may be OK with the exception being I don't want it to kick the machine into CPA mode if I invoke it via M-Codes during a cut.


If I used the M-code to ignore an arc-ok before the torch fired, I may not want it to disable the THC (I cant think why I would ignore an arc-ok at start via M-code, but the example is valid nonetheless)

M-code doesn't do it this way, M-code is the same as Enable

I follow. I think what I'm babbling about would be two different features. Really what I was thinking earlier today was that Mesh mode and the ability to ignore arc-ok at any point during a cut via M-codes would be mutually exclusive. To summarize the difference:

Mesh mode enable via the GUI Console would do everything it already does:
1. Ignore Arc ok after motion is established
2. Disable THC
3. Kick HT machines into CPA mode
4. If Ignore-OK is checked, it ignores arc-ok on the beginning of a cut
(Mesh Mode from the run GUI is currently perfect)


M-Codes (62/63 P1 and 64/65 P1) would:
1. Only Ignore Arc-Ok for the duration it's specified via M code (Mesh Mode check boxes would have no effect here, because you would control where it applies via where it's placed in the code (Before the M3 would ignore the Arc OK on start, After the M3 would ignore Arc-Ok after motion is established) and there are already M code controls to disable the THC)



Hopefully my vision makes sense at least? I think the above summaries are best-case scenarios, I think at a minimum to get to testing the ideas I have in my head, I need for it to not kick the machine into CPA mode if I use the M codes to ignore Arc-Ok. Sorry to be confusing :S :silly:
Last edit: 12 Aug 2020 00:11 by snowgoer540.

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12 Aug 2020 00:22 #177964 by phillc54
Replied by phillc54 on topic Feature Request

Mesh mode enable via the GUI Console would do everything it already does:
1. Ignore Arc ok after motion is established
2. Disable THC
3. Kick HT machines into CPA mode
4. If Ignore-OK is checked, it ignores arc-ok on the beginning of a cut
(Mesh Mode from the run GUI is currently perfect)

Except we would need to be able to use Ignore OK while not in mesh mode and if that is the case then we should not be able to save that parameter as well.


M-Codes (62/63 P1 and 64/65 P1) would:
1. Only Ignore Arc-Ok for the duration it's specified via M code (Mesh Mode check boxes would have no effect here, because you would control where it applies via where it's placed in the code (Before the M3 would ignore the Arc OK on start, After the M3 would ignore Arc-Ok after motion is established) and there are already M code controls to disable the THC)

So this would be a totally separate feature with no connection to mesh mode.

The ignore Arc OK IS a bit confusing in that it can mean two entirely different things.

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12 Aug 2020 00:24 #177965 by PCW
Replied by PCW on topic Feature Request
Warning: crazy know-nothing idea ahead...

Is Arc-OK fast enough to detect when the torch is cutting the mesh?
If so I wonder if you could not capture (sample/hold) the plasma voltage
and implement a crude bang-bang THC?

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12 Aug 2020 00:37 #177967 by snowgoer540
Replied by snowgoer540 on topic Feature Request

phillc54 wrote:

Except we would need to be able to use Ignore OK while not in mesh mode and if that is the case then we should not be able to save that parameter as well.

I'm not sure I follow, except I think what you are saying may have something to do with the behind the curtains coding stuffs?


So this would be a totally separate feature with no connection to mesh mode.

Yes, I think Mesh Mode is perfect as it is.

M-Code P1 would be separate from Mesh Mode. When M code P1 parameter is invoked, it would simply ignore the "Ok-To-Move" signal from the plasma power source.


The ignore Arc OK IS a bit confusing in that it can mean two entirely different things.

I agree, I think we are confusing terms. Rewritten with new terms:

Mesh Mode enable via the GUI Console would do everything it already does:
1. Ignore Ok-To-Move signal from the power source after motion is established
2. Disable THC
3. Kick HT machines into CPA mode
4. If Ignore-OK is checked, it ignores the need for an Ok-To-Move signal at the beginning of a cut to start cutting motion
(Mesh Mode from the run GUI is currently perfect)


M-Codes (62/63 P1 and 64/65 P1) would:
1. Only Ignore Ok-To-Move signal for the duration it's specified via M code (Mesh Mode check boxes would have no effect here, because you would control where it applies via where it's placed in the code. For example: before the M3 would ignore the Ok-To-Move signal on start; Placed after the M3 would ignore Ok-To-move signal while motion is established. There are already M code P values to disable the THC, so it's redundant to get it to do both.

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12 Aug 2020 00:42 #177968 by snowgoer540
Replied by snowgoer540 on topic Feature Request

PCW wrote: Warning: crazy know-nothing idea ahead...

Is Arc-OK fast enough to detect when the torch is cutting the mesh?
If so I wonder if you could not capture (sample/hold) the plasma voltage
and implement a crude bang-bang THC?


Interesting thing, I'm not really sure either... I will say that from my (albeit limited) experience cutting expanded mesh metal, the THC wasn't really necessary, I kept it high enough to ensure that I could get an arc and sever the individual grids, without crashing the torch. That said, my piece was fairly flat...

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12 Aug 2020 00:47 #177969 by phillc54
Replied by phillc54 on topic Feature Request

snowgoer540 wrote:

phillc54 wrote:

Except we would need to be able to use Ignore OK while not in mesh mode and if that is the case then we should not be able to save that parameter as well.

I'm not sure I follow, except I think what you are saying may have something to do with the behind the curtains coding stuffs?

This is for Rods suggestion which I think makes sense. If you use single cut to sever a sheet then you need to be precise on where to place the torch in X/Y. If we can use Ignore OK separately from mesh-mode then it doesn't matter, you could check Ignore OK so it would start the cut even if it is past the edge of the sheet. If we do this then we would NOT want to save to the cfg file as the default.


There are already M code P values to disable the THC, so it's redundant to get it to do both.

Correct, but I think it should be disabled automatically if you are ignoring the Arc OK using this method as I think if you select this mode then you are expecting abnormal voltage variations and/or cutouts.

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12 Aug 2020 00:49 #177970 by phillc54
Replied by phillc54 on topic Feature Request

snowgoer540 wrote:

PCW wrote: Warning: crazy know-nothing idea ahead...

Is Arc-OK fast enough to detect when the torch is cutting the mesh?
If so I wonder if you could not capture (sample/hold) the plasma voltage
and implement a crude bang-bang THC?


Interesting thing, I'm not really sure either... I will say that from my (albeit limited) experience cutting expanded mesh metal, the THC wasn't really necessary, I kept it high enough to ensure that I could get an arc and sever the individual grids, without crashing the torch. That said, my piece was fairly flat...


I don't have Arc OK so I cannot test it. I would imagine that it would vary quite a bit between manufacturers.

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12 Aug 2020 00:53 #177971 by snowgoer540
Replied by snowgoer540 on topic Feature Request

phillc54 wrote:

I'm not sure I follow, except I think what you are saying may have something to do with the behind the curtains coding stuffs?

This is for Rods suggestion which I think makes sense. If you use single cut to sever a sheet then you need to be precise on where to place the torch in X/Y. If we can use Ignore OK separately from mesh-mode then it doesn't matter, you could check Ignore OK so it would start the cut even if it is past the edge of the sheet. If we do this then we would NOT want to save to the cfg file as the default.

OH! Ok!. Yes, I agree, that's a great idea. Sorry I was extra dense about that one from the get go :blush:


There are already M code P values to disable the THC, so it's redundant to get it to do both.

Correct, but I think it should be disabled automatically if you are ignoring the Arc OK using this method as I think if you select this mode then you are expecting abnormal voltage variations and/or cutouts.

I'm fine with that, it beats forgetting and crashing the torch.

So to make sure we are on the same page:
M62/63 P1 M64/65 P1 should:
1. Be independent of Mesh Mode Check boxes
2. Ignore Ok-To-Move signal
3. Disable THC

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12 Aug 2020 01:00 #177972 by phillc54
Replied by phillc54 on topic Feature Request

snowgoer540 wrote: So to make sure we are on the same page:
M62/63 P1 M64/65 P1 should:
1. Be independent of Mesh Mode Check boxes
2. Ignore Ok-To-Move signal
3. Disable THC


Yes, but if the HAL pin and the Enable checkbutton were active simultaneously then it would be the same as having mesh Enable checked and Ignore OK checked regardless of whether Ignore OK was checked or not.

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12 Aug 2020 01:09 #177974 by snowgoer540
Replied by snowgoer540 on topic Feature Request

phillc54 wrote:

snowgoer540 wrote: So to make sure we are on the same page:
M62/63 P1 M64/65 P1 should:
1. Be independent of Mesh Mode Check boxes
2. Ignore Ok-To-Move signal
3. Disable THC


Yes, but if the HAL pin and the Enable checkbutton were active simultaneously then it would be the same as having mesh Enable checked and Ignore OK checked regardless of whether Ignore OK was checked or not.


I think I follow. I can only speak for myself, but I would just make sure both are unchecked if I planned to control via the HAL pin (assuming this means M code P1). They default to the off status and don't save between sessions anyhow.

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